2 readers online now  |  69 million page views

Jesus and the Prophecies

Reader comment on item: A Christian Boom
in response to reader comment: Problems

Submitted by Servant of Christ (United States), Dec 17, 2006 at 17:20

You say that Jesus was foretold in Isaiah 42 and Isaiah 53 but they is a problem because in Isaiah 42 it says the following: 3 A bruised reed he will not break, and a smoldering wick he will not snuff out. In faithfulness he will bring forth justice; 4 he will not falter or be discouraged till he establishes justice on earth. In his law the islands will put their hope." And in Isaiah 53 it says the following: 2 He grew up before him like a tender shoot, and like a root out of dry ground. He had no beauty or majesty to attract us to him, nothing in his appearance that we should desire him. 3 He was despised and rejected by men, a man of sorrows, and familiar with suffering. Like one from whom men hide their faces he was despised, and we esteemed him not. 7 He was oppressed and afflicted, yet he did not open his mouth; he was led like a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is silent, so he did not open his mouth.

I fail to see how these two contradict. One passage talks about the righteousness of the Messiah and the other talks about the humility of the Messiah. Some put their faith in him and others did not. No contradiction, and both describe Jesus.

Another problem is that Isaiah 53 carries on from Isaiah 52 which talks about Israel and not Jesus. Here are prophecies about the Messiah:

Israel cannot be the thing Isaiah 53 spoke of because it is grammatically incorrect and awkward while Israel was never ‘sprinkled' for all nations. Sprinkled signifies sacrifice for sins. If you don't believe me then study Leviticus in which the term sprinkle pertains to sacrifice. Israel was never sacrificed for the sins of the Gentiles and Israel certainly wasn't blameless!

1. The Messiah is preceded by Elijah the prophet who, with the Messiah, unifies the family (Malachi 4:5-6), which is contradicted by Jesus in Matthew 10:34-37. 2. The Messiah re-establishes the Davidic dynasty through the messiah's own children (Daniel 7:13-14). But Jesus had no children.

The Elijah was John the Baptist. This was revealed during the Transfiguration. Before you start saying that John 1 says that John denied being Elijah, let me explain who Elijah is. In Malachi 4:5, it reads, ""See, I will send you the prophet Elijah before that great and dreadful day of the LORD comes.".

This is verse is fulfilled:

11Then an angel of the Lord appeared to him, standing at the right side of the altar of incense. 12When Zechariah saw him, he was startled and was gripped with fear. 13But the angel said to him: "Do not be afraid, Zechariah; your prayer has been heard. Your wife Elizabeth will bear you a son, and you are to give him the name John. 14He will be a joy and delight to you, and many will rejoice because of his birth, 15for he will be great in the sight of the Lord. He is never to take wine or other fermented drink, and he will be filled with the Holy Spirit even from birth.16Many of the people of Israel will he bring back to the Lord their God. 17And he will go on before the Lord, in the spirit and power of Elijah, to turn the hearts of the fathers to their children and the disobedient to the wisdom of the righteous—to make ready a people prepared for the Lord." (Luke 1:11-17 NIV) emphasis added

So this is what it is saying. The spirit of Elijah was with John and John denied that he was Elijah because the Jews thought that John was the living, walking, actual Elijah. Of course, you are familiar with the spirit of Elijah and his disciple Elisha right? It is very similar to this. John's role was of unifying the believers.

Jesus Christ's role was unifying the believers and disunifying the world. Remember the context, Christianity was to be heavily persecuted, so Jesus warned his followers that loved ones may betray them. Did this mean that Jesus told his followers to fight them with the sword as Islam taught? No.

"In my vision at night I looked, and there before me was one like a son of man, coming with the clouds of heaven. He approached the Ancient of Days and was led into his presence. 14 He was given authority, glory and sovereign power; all peoples, nations and men of every language worshiped him. His dominion is an everlasting dominion that will not pass away, and his kingdom is one that will never be destroyed.

That is the verse of Daniel you quoted. Jesus re-established the Davidic line; however, it does not say that Jesus would have offspring. It just said he would have an everlasting kingdom. Since you quoted Daniel, does that mean you accept what he said as inspired? If so, Jesus is the Messiah since his favorite name for himself was the "Son of Man".

32He will be great and will be called the Son of the Most High. The Lord God will give him the throne of his father David, 33and he will reign over the house of Jacob forever; his kingdom will never end."
(Luke 1:32-33 NIV) emphasis added

3. The Messiah brings an eternal peace between all nations, between all peoples, and between all people (Isaiah 2:2-4; Micah 4:1-4; Ezekiel 39:9). Obviously there is no peace. Furthermore, Jesus said that his purpose in coming was to bring a sword, and not peace (see Matthew 10:34, as referenced above.)

Yes, the Messiah will bring peace in his SECOND COMING. Jesus will establish a millenium of peace and after that Satan will revolt and then Jesus will finish evil once and for all. And there is your eternal peace.

This sword that Jesus speaks about is not a physical sword. No, it is the spiritual sword, the word of the living God. It is the Gospel. The world is to be divided. The Christians will not. Finally, when he returns, the world will be united at last. Peace for the believers and dissension for the unbelievers.

4. The Messiah brings about the universal world-wide conversion of all peoples to Judaism, or at least to Ethical Monotheism (Jeremiah 31:31-34; Zechariah 8:23; Isaiah 11:9; Zechariah 14:9,16). But the world remains steeped in idolatry.

Jeremiah 31:31-34 talks about the New Covenant. God is saying that Jesus will make the New Covenant and the Holy Spirit will speak through us. The Gospel testifies to this as well.

Zechariah 8 doesn't mention the Messiah anywhere.

Isaiah talks about a worldwide peace and how all nations will follow the Messiah. This will happen in the Millenium that John writes about in Revelation.

Zechariah 14:9, 16 talks about how the LORD will reign over all the earth. This is the Millenium that has still yet to come which deals with the Second Coming.

5. The Messiah brings about an end to all forms of idolatry (Zechariah 13:2). But the world remains steeped in idolatry.

I'm so glad you brought that up! Let's go to some verses preceding that:

"And I will pour out on the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem a spirit of grace and supplication. They will look on me, the one they have pierced, and they will mourn for him as one mourns for an only child, and grieve bitterly for him as one grieves for a firstborn son. 11 On that day the weeping in Jerusalem will be great, like the weeping of Hadad Rimmon in the plain of Megiddo. 12 The land will mourn, each clan by itself, with their wives by themselves: the clan of the house of David and their wives, the clan of the house of Nathan and their wives, 13 the clan of the house of Levi and their wives, the clan of Shimei and their wives, 14 and all the rest of the clans and their wives. (Zechariah 12:10-14 NIV) emphasis added

The people will look on the Lord because he is the one who they pierced. God is saying and uses a first person singular to refer to himself. Since Israel has yet to mourn for Jesus, the idolatry is not over. The Day of the Lord is still not here, but it will come in the Second Coming and the Millennium.

6. The Messiah brings about a universal recognition that the Jewish idea of God is God (Isaiah 11:9). But the world remains steeped in idolatry.

Verse? Anyways, the Second Coming explains this too.

7. The Messiah leads the world to become vegetarian (Isaiah 11:6-9). It isn't.

This is the New Jerusalem (or heaven), in which God will redo creation.

8. The Messiah gathers to Israel, all of the twelve tribes (Ezekiel 36:24). Many of the ten lost tribes remain lost.

Ezekiel just says God will bring the Israelites back to their own land. Where does it say anything about the twelve tribes?

9. The Messiah rebuilds The Temple (Isaiah 2:2; Ezekiel 37:26-28). It hasn't been rebuilt.

Yes, the New Temple. The Messiah's temple is the Holy City of New Jerusalem.

10. There will be no more famine (Ezekiel 36:29-30). People starve to death every day.

No more famine in Israel to be exact. However, even if there is famine in Israel, it does not disprove the Messiah. Since God never said that the coming of the Messiah and the reunification of Israel had to be together.

11. After the Messiah comes, death will eventually cease (Isaiah 25:8). People die every day.

14Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.
(Revelation 20:24 NIV)

Death has lost its sting, it will perish when Jesus Christ returns.

12. Eventually the dead will be resurrected (Isaiah 26:19; Daniel 12:2; Ezekiel 37:12-13; Isaiah 43:5-6);

52The tombs broke open and the bodies of many holy people who had died were raised to life. (Matthew 27:52 NIV)

There will be another one when Christ rules the world.

13. The nations of the earth will help the Jews, materially (Isaiah 60:5-6; 60:10-12; )

This is still being fulfilled, evidenced by the Western aid in reforming Israel. However, it will be finished in Christ's second coming.

14. The Jews will be sought out for spiritual guidance (Zechariah 8:23);

What does this have to the with the Messiah?

15. All weapons will be destroyed (Ezekiel 39:9,12);

The Day of the Lord has not come yet.

16. The Nile will run dry (Isaiah 11:15)

The Day of the Lord has not come yet.

17. Monthly, the trees of Israel will yield their fruit (Ezekiel 47:12);

The Temple hasn't been built… yet.

18. Each tribe of Israel will receive and settle their inherited land (Ezekiel 47:13-13).

How does this related to the Messiah?

They are no other prophecies about the Messiah which say he will be God's son or God himself.

It seems that you seem to have gotten the Day of the Lord mixed up with the coming of the Messiah.

The LORD says to my Lord:
"Sit at my right hand
until I make your enemies
a footstool for your feet." (Psalm 110:1 NIV)

YHWH says to YHWH, Father says to the Son. The rest of Psalm 110 talks about how all the power will go to the Son.

I will proclaim the decree of the LORD :
He said to me, "You are my Son ;
today I have become your Father.
8 Ask of me,
and I will make the nations your inheritance,
the ends of the earth your possession.
9 You will rule them with an iron scepter;
you will dash them to pieces like pottery."
10 Therefore, you kings, be wise;
be warned, you rulers of the earth.
11 Serve the LORD with fear
and rejoice with trembling.
12 Kiss the Son, lest he be angry
and you be destroyed in your way,
for his wrath can flare up in a moment.
Blessed are all who take refuge in him.(Psalm 2:7-12 NIV)

What king has God said, "You are my Son"? What king has ruled all the ends of the earth?

Then we also have the Zechariah prophecy earlier in which God says that they have pierced him for their transgressions.

You say that Isaiah 9:6 does not mean that the Messiah is God himself (despite what the Jews believed).

We also have Micah 5:2:

But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting (KJV).

Jesus was from Bethlehem and was also the King of the Jews. The Messiah was from ‘everlasting'. Tell me, who alone has existed since the beginning of time? God.

But unto you that fear my name shall the Sun of righteousness arise with healing in his wings; and ye shall go forth, and grow up as calves of the stall. (Malachi 4:2 KJV)

The Messiah was the Sun of Righteousness who had healing in his wings.

Messianic prophecies are one way of validating Jesus' testimony. But why not look at the Gospels themselves. Can't you see all four Gospel clearly show that Jesus is God?

May God Bless You All

Submitting....

Note: Opinions expressed in comments are those of the authors alone and not necessarily those of Daniel Pipes. Original writing only, please. Comments are screened and in some cases edited before posting. Reasoned disagreement is welcome but not comments that are scurrilous, off-topic, commercial, disparaging religions, or otherwise inappropriate. For complete regulations, see the "Guidelines for Reader Comments".

Comment on this item

Mark my comment as a response to Jesus and the Prophecies by Servant of Christ

Email me if someone replies to my comment

Note: Opinions expressed in comments are those of the authors alone and not necessarily those of Daniel Pipes. Original writing only, please. Comments are screened and in some cases edited before posting. Reasoned disagreement is welcome but not comments that are scurrilous, off-topic, commercial, disparaging religions, or otherwise inappropriate. For complete regulations, see the "Guidelines for Reader Comments".

See recent outstanding comments.

Follow Daniel Pipes

Facebook   Twitter   RSS   Join Mailing List
eXTReMe Tracker

All materials by Daniel Pipes on this site: © 1968-2020 Daniel Pipes. daniel.pipes@gmail.com and @DanielPipes

Support Daniel Pipes' work with a tax-deductible donation to the Middle East Forum.Daniel J. Pipes

(The MEF is a publicly supported, nonprofit organization under section 501(c)3 of the Internal Revenue Code.

Contributions are tax deductible to the full extent allowed by law. Tax-ID 23-774-9796, approved Apr. 27, 1998.

For more information, view our IRS letter of determination.)