2 readers online now  |  69 million page views

To Shakeel: Bring your proof II

Reader comment on item: Bolstering Moderate Muslims
in response to reader comment: To Shakeel: You got me with my forgotten promise to god.

Submitted by Plato (United Arab Emirates), May 26, 2007 at 09:13

Shakeel, you are in brackets

[God's judgment is to be implemented on all those people who were preached and warned by Rasool. No one can escape God's judgment. Muhammad (sws) only did his duty. If he did not advise it, even then God had killed all of them and Muhammad were also punished for the not doing his duty. Again, God is not merciless, it is His promise with all of us that He will surely reward the righteous among us and punish wrong-doers. And He is just and His promise is true.]

I have heard of confusion worse confounded. I do not know what to think of what you have said here. And you have not answered why an apostate is a wrong doer. Avoiding clear, direct anwers is a technique well-honed by Muslim posters.

And again a very good non-answer Shakeel. Here is what I wrote: "Oh the lucky Persians, Egyptians. So if you are out earshot of the Prophet when he is preaching you escape an early death? Let us forget the lucky Persians and Egyptians for a moment. What about the unlucky millions in India. Unluckily for the Hindus the companions did not live long enough for them to be conquered by them. So they had to suffer tens of millions dead by Muslims who were not companions and had no such instructions."

And here is your reply: " Indians were never forced to convert to Islam. In fact, Hindus were treated as Ahl-Kitab rather than polytheists. Also, since Muhammad as a Rasool preached only Arabs, so only those people were to be judged by God. Through them, God has teached a lesson to all of us that Day of Judgment is surely true, it will surely come and God is just and His promise is true and He will surely punish wrong doers and reward righteous.

Have I said anything about Hindus being converted, that also happened on a mass scale. I was telling you about the millions massacred in the name of Allah and his Prophet. Proof?


Shahab-ul-Din, King of Ghazni (1170-1206), put Prithwi Raj, King of Ajmer and Delhi, to death in cold blood. He massacred thousands of inhabitants of Ajmer who opposed him, reserving the remaining for slavery [The Kamiu-t Tawarikh, by Ibn-Asir]. Historian Hasan Nizami in his Taj-ul-Ma'sir gives the following account of Ghouri's Lieutenant Qutbuddin Aibak's activities:

....after the suppression of a Hindu revolt at Kol (modern day Aligarh) in 1193 AD, Aibak raised "three bastions as high as heaven with their heads, and their carcasses became food for beasts of prey. The tract was freed from idols and idol worship and the foundations of infidelism were destroyed."

In 1194 AD Aibak destroyed 27 Hindu temples at Delhi and built the Quwwat-ul-lslam mosque with their debris. According to Nizami, Aibak "adorned it with the stones and gold obtained from the temples which had been demolished by elephants".

In 1195 AD the Mher tribe of Ajmer rose in revolt, and the Chaulukyas of Gujarat came to their assistance. Aibak had to invite reinforcements from Ghazni before he could meet the challenge. In 1196 AD he advanced against Anahilwar Patan, the capital of Gujarat. Nizami writes that after Raja Karan was defeated and forced to flee, "fifty thousand infidels were dispatched to hell by the sword" and "more than twenty thousand slaves, and cattle beyond all calculation fell into the hands of the victors".

The city was sacked, its temples demolished, and its palaces plundered. On his return to Ajmer, Aibak destroyed the Sanskrit College of Visaladeva, and laid the foundations of a mosque which came to be known as 'Adhai Din ka Jhompada'.

Conquest of Kalinjar in 1202 AD was Aibak's crowning achievement. Nizami concludes: "The temples were converted into mosques... Fifty thousand men came under the collar of slavery and the plain became black as pitch with Hindus."

Amir Khusru, a disciple of the great Sufi Nizamuddin Awliya and recognized to be a liberal Sufi Muslim himself, writes in his Tarikh-i-Alai:

"Here he (Malik Kafur) heard that in Bramastpuri (Chidambaram) there was a golden idol- He then determined on razing the temple to the ground- It was the holy place of the Hindus which the Malik dug up from its foundations with the greatest care, and the heads of brahmans and idolaters danced from their necks and fell to the ground at their feet, and blood flowed in torrents. The stone idols called Ling Mahadeo, which had been established a long time at the place and on which the women of the infidels rubbed their vaginas for (sexual) satisfaction, these, up to this time, the kick of the horse of Islam had not attempted to break. The Musulmans destroyed in the lings and Deo Narain fell down, and other gods who had fixed their seats there raised feet and jumped so high that at one leap they reached the fort of Lanka, and in that affright the lings themselves would have fled had they had any legs to stand on".

The world famous historian, Will Durant has written in his 'Story of Civilization' that "the Mohammedan conquest of India was probably the bloodiest story in history".

India, before the advent of Islamic imperialism, was not exactly a zone of complete tranquility and peace like many other parts of the world. There were plenty of wars fought by Hindu princes. Despite all these wars, the Hindus had observed some time-honored conventions sanctioned by the Sastras. The Brahmins and the Bhikshus were never molested. The cows were never killed. The temples were never touched. The chastity of women was never violated. The non-combatants were never killed or captured. A human habitation was never attacked unless it was a fort. The civil population was never plundered. War booty was an unknown item in the calculations of conquerors. The martial classes, who clashed, mostly in open spaces, had a code of honor. Sacrifice of honor for victory or material gain was deemed as worse than death.

Islamic imperialism came with a different code - the Sunnah of the Prophet. It required its warriors to fall upon the helpless civil population after a decisive victory had been won on the battlefield. It required them to sack and burn down villages and towns after the defenders had died fighting or had fled. The cows, the Brahmins, and the Bhikshus invited their special attention in mass murders of non-combatants. The temples and monasteries were their special targets in an orgy of pillage and arson. Those whom they did not kill, they captured and sold as slaves. The magnitude of the booty looted even from the bodies of the dead, was a measure of the success of a military mission. And they did all this as mujahids (holy warriors) and ghazls (kafir-killers) in the service of Allah and his Last Prophet.

It is estimated that the Islamic conquest and rule in India may have resulted in killing of an estimated 50-80 million Hindus and other indigenous religion people. Such savagery can only be compared to the one committed by the Spaniards in the South American continent. Koenraad Elst estimates that out of the population of native Continental South America of 1492, which stood at 90 million, only 32 million survived; terrible figures indeed but who talks about them today [Negationism in India]? Such a towering figure of destruction of human lives by the Muslim rulers of India may appear a suspect. However, in the war of independence of Bangladesh, the Pakistanis killed 2-3 million people in just 9 month in the age of modern civilization and the world hardly took a notice of it. Hence, it is hardly impossible that Islamic rulers might have had condemned up to 80 million indigenous people to death in a vast region in a long span of almost 1000 years in the medieval age of barbarity. ..(http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/1653953/posts)

As you can see, Shakeel, we infidels do our homework before we post here. Get your Koran, biographies, hadiths, histories and read them again, with care, before commenting on your religion. We take those stickers Muslims paste on their cars about reading the Koran and about the Prophet seriously.

Such vivid descriptions of savagery mostly come from the works of the Muslim historians and writers, one of them include even the highly liberal and benevolent disciple of great Sufi dervish, Nizamuddin Awliya. A few examples of barbaric atrocities of Muslim invaders and rulers of India, recorded by the Muslim historians themselves, are listed below:

Note: Opinions expressed in comments are those of the authors alone and not necessarily those of Daniel Pipes. Original writing only, please. Comments are screened and in some cases edited before posting. Reasoned disagreement is welcome but not comments that are scurrilous, off-topic, commercial, disparaging religions, or otherwise inappropriate. For complete regulations, see the "Guidelines for Reader Comments".

Comment on this item

Mark my comment as a response to To Shakeel: Bring your proof II by Plato

Email me if someone replies to my comment

Note: Opinions expressed in comments are those of the authors alone and not necessarily those of Daniel Pipes. Original writing only, please. Comments are screened and in some cases edited before posting. Reasoned disagreement is welcome but not comments that are scurrilous, off-topic, commercial, disparaging religions, or otherwise inappropriate. For complete regulations, see the "Guidelines for Reader Comments".

See recent outstanding comments.

Follow Daniel Pipes

Facebook   Twitter   RSS   Join Mailing List

All materials by Daniel Pipes on this site: © 1968-2021 Daniel Pipes. daniel.pipes@gmail.com and @DanielPipes

Support Daniel Pipes' work with a tax-deductible donation to the Middle East Forum.Daniel J. Pipes

(The MEF is a publicly supported, nonprofit organization under section 501(c)3 of the Internal Revenue Code.

Contributions are tax deductible to the full extent allowed by law. Tax-ID 23-774-9796, approved Apr. 27, 1998.

For more information, view our IRS letter of determination.)