69 million page views

Our Dear M&M and his bogus claims

Reader comment on item: Bolstering Moderate Muslims
in response to reader comment: My response

Submitted by dhimmi no more (United States), May 10, 2007 at 13:28

Our dear M&M you wrote

DMN wrote: >In Q9:29 your Allah declares unconditional war on the Jews and Christians and the Hindus and the buddhists aka ahl al-kitab

Then you wrote

>No this verse is talking about the pagans of Mecca who were in a state of war with the Muslims this is established in the aya before

One word: Bogus. Where does it say in ayat al-jizya "qatiloo ahl Mecca al-mushrikeen"? Let me help you: It says: "qatiloo blah....blah...blah...al-ladhina awtoo al-kitab" or "fight blah....blah...blah...those given the book"

As a matter of fact your Allah's _final dispensation_ (based on al-nasikh wa al-mansukh) in regard to the mushrikeen of Mecca was ayat al-sayf! Or convert to Islam or be killed and there was no qatiloo and pay al-jizya any more it became iqtoloo (see what happens for Muslims who know no Arabic like you/ You are clueless are you?).

More damaging to your case is that the Muslim masorites read ayat al-jizya (do you know what the old saying "al-tafseer lel sahaba wa al-ta'weel lel fuqaha/3Ulama/jamii3" really means and do you really what the muslim masora is? I doubt very much, but this does not seem to stop you from rambling about issues that are really beyond your poor and uncritical education): as a defined pericope (do you know what is really a pericope? This means that the masorites did not see any link between Q9:28 and Q9:29

So who are really ahl al-kitab? We do not know as the opaque revelation called the Qur'an does not tell us as usual, we only know what the 3Ulama who were telling us (see the above saying) in the 3rd century of Islam in distant Persia and Mesopotamia that ahl al-Kitab were really Jews and Christians and Zoroastrians who were also included by 3Umar the so called al-Farooq (any group that had a defined holy text and for this see Noth and Hoyland). But again your Allah and his rasul had no clue about the world beyond Arabia and had no clue about Hinduism and Buddhism, but both religions are supposed to be regarded as ahl al-kitab as per our dear Karen Armstrong the wannabe historian, as both religions have defined holy kutub (books). So you do not believe our dear Ms Armstrong? I see! May be you can write here but she is as clueless as you are. And how come your Allah and his rasul did not know about Hindus and Buddhists? Unless your Allah is a local Arabian deity!

Your are either ignorant or you are making things up so which one is it our dear M&M?

>second it does not say anything about Christians, Jews Hindus, Buddhists bacause the latter two are not ahl al-kitab

Bogus again. You just wrote that Q9:29 is about ahl Mecca al-Mushrikeen which means that those awtool al-kitab in the aya are the mushrikeen of Mecca and not the Christians and Jews! Now do you get it and can you see why I have no respect for you? Now you are caught in your own ignorance or lies so which one is it?

Stay tuned for more and you wil learn about giving numbers to the Quranic suras and ayas and that none of this dropped from the sky. And here is a head start for you: Surat al-Feel Q105 is called by Tabari surat "alam tara"! Go figure


Note: Opinions expressed in comments are those of the authors alone and not necessarily those of Daniel Pipes. Original writing only, please. Comments are screened and in some cases edited before posting. Reasoned disagreement is welcome but not comments that are scurrilous, off-topic, commercial, disparaging religions, or otherwise inappropriate. For complete regulations, see the "Guidelines for Reader Comments".

Follow Daniel Pipes

Facebook   Twitter   RSS   Join Mailing List

All materials by Daniel Pipes on this site: © 1968-2024 Daniel Pipes. daniel.pipes@gmail.com and @DanielPipes

Support Daniel Pipes' work with a tax-deductible donation to the Middle East Forum.Daniel J. Pipes

(The MEF is a publicly supported, nonprofit organization under section 501(c)3 of the Internal Revenue Code.

Contributions are tax deductible to the full extent allowed by law. Tax-ID 23-774-9796, approved Apr. 27, 1998.

For more information, view our IRS letter of determination.)