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European Enlightenment and Turkish Witch-Hunters

Reader comment on item: Turkey: An Ally No More
in response to reader comment: European Enlightenment - 'Christianity's Civilization Missions' - Part I - 'Kill them all ! God will know His own.'

Submitted by Ianus (Poland), Jan 27, 2010 at 17:17

Turk wrote :

I refer your inability to see most rationally visible things to your Islam which you have, characteristically enough, not deigned to address even once in your reply, albeit it does stand at the core of all our discussion and ALL the problems jihadist Turkey has been creating. The difference between Christianity and Islam is roughly speaking reducible to the difference between the respective founders of both religions. On the one hand you have a noble learned man who hasn't harmed a single human being in his life and on the other you can see a primitive greedy Beduin gangster with a pack of blood-thirsty cut-throats and criminals building their new 'faith' on the mountains of cut off heads and corspes and ordering their followers to do exactly the same! You have on the one hand a man of peace, on the other an evil terrorist and murderer.The first man is called Jesus, the other Muhammed

Did you remember the reply of Arnaud-Armaury, the Abbot of Citeaux in the 1200's as when he was asked how to identify the heretics prior to slaughtering all 20,000 residents of the town ?

"Kill them all. God will know His own" (Neca eos omnes. Deus suos agnoset )<

Were it not for the missing "c" in "agnosCet", I'd call it excellent Latin, Turk ! Anyway, you should know without my prompt that what the abbot said has nothing to do with what the founder of the abbot's religion did and said while what Mohammed said and did is valid until now and I wonder which Turkish imam has abrogated e.g. jihad or "Whoever leaves Islam , kill him'? I'll gladly read a Turkish fatwa issued by the Diyanet to the effect.

> "Therefore, I am convinced that I am acting as the agent of our Creator. By fighting off the Jews, I am doing the Lord's work." Adolf Hitler. <

If you suggest Hitler was the founder of Christianity, then my congratulations. We are speaking here about Jesus vs. Muhammed, if you have missed the point. Your favourite trick of evading the point and whitewashing Islam by false analogies, anachronistic comparisons and angry far-fetched counter-accusations doesn't work here. So revert to the original statement you should reconsider : "The difference between Christianity and Islam is roughly speaking reducible to the difference between the respective founders of both religions. On the one hand you have a noble learned man who hasn't harmed a single human being in his life and on the other you can see a primitive greedy Beduin gangster with a pack of blood-thirsty cut-throats and criminals building their new 'faith' on the mountains of cut off heads and corspes and ordering their followers to do exactly the same".

What mistake can you see in this statement ?

> You should also remember his words after the assasination attemptin Munich in November, 1939. His response: "Now I am completely content. The fact that I left the Burgerbraukeller earlier than usual is a corroboration of Providence's intention to let me reach my goal."<

Hitler is irrelevant speaking of Jesus.Just like I could do without Osama or Ghazi Kemal while speaking of Mohammed's evil-doings. So let me ask you directly "Do you admit that Mohammed , the founder of Islam, was a criminal, rapist, gangster and perverted mass murderer?" I expect the "yes" or "no" answer without referring to abbots, Hitlers,Stalins,Christian-based NKVD, bishops, popes etc.etc.

> The Pope also sent his special personal congratulations! Later the Pope was to publicly describe Hitler's opposition to Russia as a "high-minded gallantry in defense of the foundation of Christian culture." Several German bishops openly supported Hitler's invasion of Russia, calling it a "European crusade."<

So now instead of concentrating on Byzantine and Turkish history we switch to Hiter and Stalin ...when will you suggest the American flight to the moon to see the evidence of the correctness of Muhammad's miracle of splitting the moon?

> Your reply fails to explain how the peacefull religion of the circumsized Carpenter turned out to be an excuse of dominion, exploitation, brutality, frequently supported by the Church.<

Evidently, it was not the peaceful religion of the circumcised carpenter of Bethleem, if you can compare two things while the Turkish bestiliaties were exactly what the Beduin murderer with epileptic fits had been doing and teaching in his lifetime. Do we disagree on that point? A yes or no answer , PLEASE!

> How do you associate inquisitions, mass murders and all other atrocities done in name of someone who never harmed anyone all though his life ?

I don't associate it with his name. How about you ? Jesus didn't kill, rape or burnt alive anybody. He can be blamed for his own short-comings only.

Now the point you raise is quite different and has nothing to with religion. Our civilization was born later , after the Middle Ages. Yours has stuck in the dirtiest Middle Ages. Our civilization produced rationalism, Voltaire. Yours is an obscurantist parody of the world and I'd love to see a Moslem Voltaire a lot. I see clearly that you are the last to be a candidate for the role. You tell me about what happened in the Middle Ages and I tell you that we in Europe exposed all of it and thanks to us you can read about it. We realize our crimes in the past. You never admit yours. You in the Moslem Orient keep them hidden and kill those that dare expose your holy murderers be they called Muhammed be Ghazi Kemal Mustafa! That's the essential unbridgeable gulf between our civilizations. You Moslems are primitive, nasty, malicious parasites of our civilization that tell us how your Moslem parasitism is superior to us because you terrorize and slaughter those that call a spade a spade! We have freedom of speech and this is ENLIGHTENMENT. You have had none in ALL your history and as long your minds are in the prison of Islam you will have effectively none. What is worse, you are doing your best to impose your vicious lies and savage ways and mental slavery upon us and force us to accept this intellectual enslavement you adore so much and keeps your so happy and morally elated! Yes, I detest and abhore Turks and this is because I know that all they stand for means for us here exactly what Turkishness meant for Eastern Christianity - slavery, destruction and damnation.

>Did I 'deign' enough ? Do you want to further discuss it ? Go ahead, be my guest..<

First, I need your YES or NO answers to the above questions.

>What disturbs me is to see people like you , proving that suburbs of Lodz are even better breeding grounds than Wisconsin Farms when it comes to raising 'able' McCarthyists trying to make an internet career based on mediveal stupidty.<

My comment on that is contained above. By the way, we had some Turks in the suburbs of Lodz. One came here with a Polish girl. It's a sad story. He came and kidnapped the child he made to her. She never heard of it again. It is growing perhaps near Erzerum dreaming of a career of a Turkish shahid in Chechnia. The others looked like those Turks in Germany that demolish hospitals to express their "grief" and curse older Germans als "nazis" threat to beat when those ask them to respect the local ways.

This is what I refer to…

How the Byzantines under peaceful cricumstances tended to win hearts and minds of their savage foes is visible by their success in bringing Christianity and literature to the South Slavs and to the Russians.We Slavs owe teh Bzyantines our first written works, the first testomonie sof our language, the first steps in the civilized life. The case of winning the Russians with humanity is well-documented by another medieval source your Islamically motivated ignorance must surely reject a priori.

> While my questions are still pending and floating above your head , you keep on strolling around with your previous emotional arguments consisting of 'how beautifull these Byzantines were' avoiding the answers you were supposed to write down, but popping out with above new and strange Slavo/Byzantian love affair of yours.<

Still dreaming of restoring the glory of Islam on the Balkans, what ? These Byzantines you Moslem barbarians exterminated are alive in Slavs, in their rites, ceremonies, festivities, in the Eastern Church. Their memory is alive. The Byzantines helped them survive the horrors of 400-year-old Turkish bestialities. And in 1912 they took revenge. And they will never forget neither what Nestor described nor what the Turkish yoke meant to them. We others who escaped the Turkish tyranny do remember it as well. And be sure not just in the suburbs of Lodz but in plenty of other places people realize that today's Turks by being Moslems are doing their best to drag us into their dirty past as the Osmans.

> By the way, the Russians that 'were won to humanity' are still telling that 'Stalin's murders were entirely rational' in their new text books.

( http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1051871/Stalins-mass-murders-entirely-rational-says-new-Russian-textbook-praising-tyrant.html )

You know everything about Stalin too ? My congratultions. Do you know what Stalin was planning to do with your perfidious Ataturkistan too? Do you know what the Panturkists were planning to do with Russia in case Hitler crossed the Volga? What do turkih textbooks tell you about Hitler's admiration for Kemal, about Hiter-Turkish friendship and cooperation?

> And you are writing an ode to them here forgetting also the 150.000 Poles that were exterminated by NKVD operations - It really makes me wonder if ignominy is a Polish national inheritance after reading what you have written above..<

The NKVD was also a Christian Orthodox organization ? What a revalation...similar to that of Turks being the creators of all civilziation ...your favourite topic, isn't it ?

The Church of Hagia Sophia mentioned in this account is one of these innumerable churches which you Moslems have desecrated and stolen not being able to construct anything similar to the cathedral of Justinian.

> Haga Sophia is still standing thanks to constant maintanance although it has seen two big earth quakes till then , moreover she is not surrounded by the ugly concrete buildings like Pantheon of Athens . <

How generous and noble of you! One might presume that if the bloody Christians had retained or recaptured it, it would be a ruin now. Well, one could expect everything of that apostle called Stalin or Catholic renegade Constantine XI , couldn't one?

> Wish you could come and see it one day , but we both know that most probably you will never be able to during your lifetime. Sad..<

I warn anybody who has said anything critical on YouTube or elsewhere in the internet to travel to Turkey. Turkish Witch-Hunters are lurking on the borders ready to arrest any critic of Turkishness revealed by the US to them as is evident from the Hurriyet news that needs no comments on what Turks really think of freedom of speech worldwide!

http://www.hurriyet.com.tr/english/domestic/10508304.asp

"Ankara public prosecutor Kursat Kayral has requested the identities of YouTube users, who insult Ataturk, Turkey and the country's flag from the United States Justice Ministry in order to launch an investigation into these users.

Those YouTube users determined to be living outside Turkey will be detained upon entering the country, pending the outcome of an inquest."

> So keep on looking at its videos and photos.<

I hardly need any of your advices on anything, Turk.

> For building something similar, have a look at Taj Mahal , which is definitely more meaningful in terms of aim of construction.<

I see- the greatest achievemnt of Turkish architecture ever.

The The oldest Russian Chronicle written by Nestor tells the following story udne rthe year 987 (6495):

" Vladimir summoned together his vassals and the city elders, and said to them: "Behold, the [Volga] Bolgars came before me urging me to accept their religion . Then came the Germans and praised their own faith [Catholicism]; and after them came the Jews [most likely rabbis from the receding Khazar khaganate... Finally the [Eastern Orthodox] Greeks appeared, criticizing all other faiths but commending their own, and they spoke at length, telling the history of the whole world from its beginning. …

>And ? What is the relation of Kiev Chronicle by Monk Nestor telling 'How sweet Greeks were speaking' here ? What exactly ? <

Unlike other nations as the Turks the Russians were given a free choice between four religions and they chose the most beautiful. Can't you see the point ... ?

I know that the above passage is entirely lost on your Islamism but I will never forget it until my last day although I am no Christian myself. It struck me the first time I read it and keeps amazing me even now after so many years.

>Sorry Janus. 'I am no Christian either' ,

You're worse. You're a Moslem ...

>but its does not struck me, it does not amaze me as well.<

By Allah, if it did, it would be a blasphemy and we know how Allah reacts to blasphemy, don't we?

> Most probably its due to the fact that Kiev Chronicles are mostly taken from verbal sagas and Byzantine chronicles. <

You quote obscure abbots sugegsting they are more important than Christ and now without ever hearing of Nestor (you know him as little as you knew the letter of Alexius Comnenus before I quoted it) you tell me some story which is false because it doesn't extol Islam. ;)

There are many passages where Nestor tells his personal views and he never fails to criticise what he finds wrong in Rus and extol what is right. Mark that there was no coercion in accepting Orthodoxy by Vladimir. He heard the Jews , the Moslems, the Catholics, sent envoys, asked questions. He chose the most beautiful thing which you Moslems desecrated, humiliated, raped, destroyed and all of which you now keep denying.

Anyway, it's not enough to make a claim of falsehood of anything.It's up to the contender to prove what he claims. "Kiev Chronicles are mostly taken from verbal sagas and Byzantine chronicles." does it prove they were falsified ? Nestor used many original written archives which were destroyed during the Mongol invasions and later plunderings of the Crimean Tatars. I see he falsified the story to "denigrate Islam" - this ultimate happiness of all psychopaths, gangsters and irrational misfits.

> The other reason why it does not move me is ; I am not living in the past like you do.<

What a cunning and original way to conceal one's ignorance of history by saying : " I am not living in the past like you". By way of exception, thanks for a lesson in double talk.

Aren't you suggesting that because you don't know your own history your ignorance of the subject should be an enouragement for us to imitate you? If so, thanks a lot but I decline the offer to share your ignorance.

>No I am not suggesting that. I am just suggesting you to be a bit more carefull when you are replying, because you have the habit of speaking about the things you dont know and subsequently making a clown out of yourself.<

Speaking of clowns, I am impatiently waiting for the YES -NO answers to the following question

1/ Do you admit that Mohammed , the founder of Islam, was a criminal, rapist, gangster and perverted mass murderer?

2/ Do you admit Turkish crimes and genocides commited against gavurlar ?

3/ Do you disagree that the Turkish bestiliaties I was referring to were in full accordance with what the Beduin with epileptic fits had been himself doing and teaching in his lifetime ?

4 Have you ever heard of any imam admitting the wrong-doings documented in the Islamic sources committed by Mohammed and invalidating jihad and subsequently cancelling the relevant passages in the Noble Quran ?

5/Have you ever heard of any ruling by an Islamic court of justice in a case where a Moslem and agavur were two contending parties that the Islamic court of justice issued the verdict in favour of the gavour and against the Moslem?

I assure you that answering the four questions has a direct bearing upon the subject-matter covered here including that of who is a clown here and who isn't.

Submitting....

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