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The Quranic disaster and the letters TAHA

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in response to reader comment: Repetitve old fabrications exposed, Again!

Submitted by dhimmi no more (United States), May 19, 2012 at 09:51

For the readers: and this is beyond our dear Amin and beyond his madrassa education

There is no doubt that the Qur'an has many words that have no clear meaning and examples would be kalala and ilaf and for this see http://www.danielpipes.org/comments/195468 and also see http://www.danielpipes.org/comments/195461 and these are indeed the two most celebrated strange words in the Qur'an

As for the strange words in the Qur'an this is what Sheikh al-Azhar tells us that there are indeed words in the Qur'an that have no clear meaning but he fails to explain the why and for this see http://elazhar.com/qadaiaux/10.asp and this is what he calls الكلام الغريب or the strange words and strange they are

And another Quranic disaster are those strange letters in some suras as in surat TAHA where the letters طه have no meaning but this did not stop the likes of al-Tabari and ibn Kathir to tell us that this taha could be

1. Another name for Muhammad

2. It is really Rabbi Hilel's "Golden rule" or Ta' al-ard ya rajul or stand on both feet O man

3. Or Allahu A3lam and read this as no one has a clue

4. And to add insult to injury as you can see below al-Tabari tells us that the word TAHA really means O man! Really?

5. Then he tells us that it is really O man fi al-lugha al-Suryaniyya or Syriac! Well let us check what the words O man in Syriac really means

Eastern Syriac : ܐ݇ܢܵܫܵܐ Western Syriac : ܐ݇ܢܳܫܳܐ Eastern phonetic : na:ša   English :

man , an adult male of the human species , one possessed of manly attributes , a human being , a husband

Which means that al-Tabari was either ignorant or a liar so which one is it our dear Amin?

6. oh there is more comedy then al-Tabari tells us that it is a Nabatean word from man! Wrong as the word in Nabatean would have been the Syriac word inasa or the Arabic word rajul and not this strange TAHA

7. And when nothing works he tells us that it is really حروف مقطعة or letters (and not a word) and as if we did not know

What a disaster and so much for the bogus claim that the Qur'an is a clear book

And here is what Shiekh al-Azhar tells us about these strange letters as in TAHA http://elazhar.com/qadaiaux/5.asp which is called in Arabic الكلام العاطل or the words (read this as letters) that are ineffective/blocked (read this as have no meaning) and for those of you who can read Arabic he has no clue except that TAHA thing and is it really a name for Muhammad and no more! but why would it be this way?

Oh and here is what al-Tabari says about such strange letters

الْقَوْل في تَأْويل قَوْله تَعَالَى : { طَه } . قَالَ أَبُو جَعْفَر مُحَمَّد بْن جَرير : اخْتَلَفَ أَهْل التَّأْويل في تَأْويل قَوْله : { طَه } فَقَالَ بَعْضهمْ : مَعْنَاهُ يَا رَجُل . ذكْر مَنْ قَالَ ذَلكَ : 18076 - حَدَّثَنَا ابْن حُمَيْد , قَالَ : ثنا أَبُو تُمَيْلَة , عَنْ الْحَسَن بْن وَاقد , عَنْ يَزيد النَّحْويّ , عَنْ عكْرمَة , عَنْ ابْن عَبَّاس : طَه : بالنَّبَطيَّة : يَا رَجُل . 18077 - حَدَّثَني مُحَمَّد بْن سَعْد , قَالَ : ثني أَبي , قَالَ : ثني عَمّي , قَالَ : ثني أَبي , عَنْ أَبيه , عَنْ ابْن عَبَّاس , قَوْله : { طَه مَا أَنْزَلْنَا عَلَيْك الْقُرْآن لتَشْقَى } فَإنَّ قَوْمه قَالُوا : لَقَدْ شَقيَ هَذَا الرَّجُل برَبّه , فَأَنْزَلَ اللَّه تَعَالَى ذكْره { طَه } يَعْني : يَا رَجُل { مَا أَنْزَلْنَا عَلَيْك الْقُرْآن لتَشْقَى } . 18078 - حَدَّثَنَا الْقَاسم , قَالَ : ثنا الْحُسَيْن , قَالَ : ثني حَجَّاج , عَنْ ابْن جُرَيْج , قَالَ : أَخْبَرَني عَبْد اللَّه بْن مُسْلم , أَوْ يَعْلَى بْن مُسْلم , عَنْ سَعيد بْن جُبَيْر أَنَّهُ قَالَ : طَه : يَا رَجُل بالسُّرْيَانيَّة . * - قَالَ ابْن جُرَيْج : وَأَخْبَرَني زَمْعَة بْن صَالح , عَنْ سَلَمَة بْن وَهْرَام , عَنْ عكْرمَة , عَنْ ابْن عَبَّاس , بذَلكَ أَيْضًا . قَالَ ابْن جُرَيْج , وَقَالَ مُجَاهد , ذَلكَ أَيْضًا . 18079 - حَدَّثَنَا عمْرَان بْن مُوسَى الْقَزَّاز , قَالَ : ثنا عَبْد الْوَارث بْن سَعيد , قَالَ : ثنا عُمَارَة عَنْ عكْرمَة , في قَوْله : { طَه } قَالَ : يَا رَجُل , كَلَّمَهُ بالنَّبَطيَّة . * - حَدَّثَنَا ابْن حُمَيْد , قَالَ : ثنا يَحْيَى بْن وَاضح , قَالَ : ثنا عَبْد اللَّه , عَنْ عكْرمَة , في قَوْله { طَه } قَالَ : بالنَّبَطيَّة : يَا إنْسَان . 18080 - حَدَّثَنَا مُحَمَّد بْن بَشَّار , قَالَ : ثنا أَبُو عَاصم , عَنْ قُرَّة بْن خَالد , عَنْ الضَّحَّاك , في قَوْله { طَه } قَالَ : يَا رَجُل بالنَّبَطيَّة . * - حَدَّثَنَا مُحَمَّد بْن بَشَّار , قَالَ : ثنا عَبْد الرَّحْمَن , قَالَ : ثنا سُفْيَان , عَنْ حُصَيْن , عَنْ عكْرمَة في قَوْله { طَه } قَالَ : يَا رَجُل . 18081 - حَدَّثَنَا بشْر , قَالَ : ثنا يَزيد , قَالَ : ثنا سَعيد , عَنْ قَتَادَة , قَوْله { طَه } قَالَ : يَا رَجُل , وَهيَ بالسُّرْيَانيَّة . 18082 - حَدَّثَنَا الْحَسَن , قَالَ : أَخْبَرَنَا عَبْد الرَّزَّاق , قَالَ : أَخْبَرَنَا مَعْمَر , عَنْ قَتَادَة وَالْحَسَن في قَوْله : { طَه } قَالَا : يَا رَجُل . * - حَدَّثَنَا عَنْ الْحُسَيْن , قَالَ : سَمعْت أَبَا مُعَاذ , يَقُول : أَخْبَرَنَا عُبَيْد , يَعْني ابْن سُلَيْمَان , قَالَ : سَمعْت الضَّحَّاك يَقُول في قَوْله { طَه } قَالَ : يَا رَجُل . وَقَالَ آخَرُونَ : هُوَ اسْم منْ أَسْمَاء اللَّه , وَقَسَم أَقْسَمَ اللَّه به . ذكْر مَنْ قَالَ ذَلكَ : 18083 - حَدَّثَنَا عَليّ , قَالَ : ثنا عَبْد اللَّه , قَالَ : ثَنَى مُعَاويَة , عَنْ عَليّ , عَنْ ابْن عَبَّاس , في قَوْله : { طَه } قَالَ : فَإنَّهُ قَسَم أَقْسَمَ اللَّه به , وَهُوَ اسْم منْ أَسْمَاء اللَّه . وَقَالَ آخَرُونَ : هُوَ حُرُوف هجَاء . وَقَالَ آخَرُونَ : هُوَ حُرُوف مُقَطَّعَة يَدُلّ كُلّ حَرْف منْهَا عَلَى مَعْنَى , وَاخْتَلَفُوا في ذَلكَ اخْتلَافهمْ في الم , وَقَدْ ذَكَرْنَا ذَلكَ في مَوَاضعه , وَبَيَّنَّا ذَلكَ بشَوَاهده . وَاَلَّذي هُوَ أَوْلَى بالصَّوَاب عنْدي منْ الْأَقْوَال فيه : قَوْل مَنْ قَالَ : مَعْنَاهُ : يَا رَجُل , لأَنَّهَا كَلمَة مَعْرُوفَة في عَكّ فيمَا بَلَغَني , وَأَنَّ مَعْنَاهَا فيهمْ : يَا رَجُل , أَنْشَدْت لمُتَمّم بْن نُوَيْرَة : هَتَفْت بطَهَ في الْقتَال فَلَمْ يُجبْ فَخفْت عَلَيْه أَنْ يَكُون مُوَائلَا وَقَالَ آخَر : إنَّ السَّفَاهَة طَه منْ خَلَائقكُمْ لَا بَارَكَ اللَّه في الْقَوْم الْمَلَاعين فَإذَا كَانَ ذَلكَ مَعْرُوفًا فيهمْ عَلَى مَا ذَكَرْنَا , فَالْوَاجب أَنْ يُوَجَّه تَأْويله إلَى الْمَعْرُوف فيهمْ منْ مَعْنَاهُ , وَلَا سيَّمَا إذَا وَافَقَ ذَلكَ تَأْويل أَهْل الْعلْم منْ الصَّحَابَة وَالتَّابعينَ . فَتَأْويل الْكَلَام إذَنْ : يَا رَجُل مَا أَنْزَلْنَا عَلَيْك الْقُرْآن لتَشْقَى , مَا أَنْزَلْنَاهُ عَلَيْك فَنُكَلّفك مَا لَا طَاقَة لَك به منْ الْعَمَل . وَذُكرَ أَنَّهُ قيلَ لَهُ ذَلكَ بسَبَب مَا كَانَ يَلْقَى منْ النَّصَب وَالْعَنَاء وَالسَّهَر في قيَام اللَّيْل . ذكْر مَنْ قَالَ ذَلكَ : 18084 - حَدَّثَني مُحَمَّد بْن عَمْرو , قَالَ : ثنا أَبُو عَاصم , قَالَ : ثنا عيسَى ; وَحَدَّثَني الْحَارث , قَالَ : ثنا الْحَسَن , قَالَ : ثنا وَرْقَاء , جَميعًا عَنْ ابْن أَبي نَجيح , عَنْ مُجَاهد { مَا أَنْزَلْنَا عَلَيْك الْقُرْآن لتَشْقَى } قَالَ : هيَ مثْل قَوْله : { فَاقْرَءُوا مَا تَيَسَّرَ منْهُ } 73 20 فَكَانُوا يُعَلّقُونَ الْحبَال في صُدُورهمْ في الصَّلَاة . 18085 - حَدَّثَنَا الْقَاسم , قَالَ : ثنا الْحُسَيْن , قَالَ : ثني حَجَّاج , عَنْ ابْن جُرَيْج , عَنْ مُجَاهد { مَا أَنْزَلْنَا عَلَيْك الْقُرْآن لتَشْقَى } قَالَ : في الصَّلَاة كَقَوْله : { فَاقْرَءُوا مَا تَيَسَّرَ منْهُ } 73 20 فَكَانُوا يُعَلّقُونَ الْحبَال بصُدُورهمْ في الصَّلَاة . 18086 - حَدَّثَنَا بشْر , قَالَ : ثنا يَزيد , قَالَ : ثنا سَعيد , عَنْ قَتَادَة { مَا أَنْزَلْنَا عَلَيْك الْقُرْآن لتَشْقَى } لَا وَاَللَّه مَا جَعَلَهُ اللَّه شَقيًّا , وَلَكنْ جَعَلَهُ رَحْمَة وَنُورًا , وَدَليلًا إلَى الْجَنَّة .

And the masorites sitting in distant Mesopotamia in the 3rd century of Islam were trying to decipher what this opaque revelation called the Quran is really saying and they had no luck but this does not stop Muslims now from telling us that Muslims really know what the Qur'an really says

But why would it be this way that by the 3rd century of Islam the masorites could not explain these strange words or these strange letters

The only two possible reasons are

1. It is either that the Quranic logias and pericopes pre-date Muhammad and 632CE when he died no one had a clue about the meaning of all these words but this would really detachMuhammad from the Qur'an

2. Or that the Qur'an was not canonized until the 9th century and by then the meaning of these words and letters was lost but this would detach the Qur'an from Arabia

And in my next post I will expalin again why was Wansbrough correct in his claim that the Qur'an could not have been canonized before the 9th century

One final point: It is very strange that rational people like Robert Spencer still have trust in the Islamic historical tradition as he seems to believe that the Qur'an was collected in the time of Abd al-Malik with the help of al-Hajjaj when there is no extant historical evidence to support such claim and in actual fact the collection of the Qur'an is the most confused and confusing story in Islam

I do believe that the Qur'an is really a collection of old texts written in either Syriac or in Garshouni that were used for liturgy by Christian Arabs in Mesopotamia and the Syrian desert and that the story of Uthman destroying "variant' reading is no more than who ever collected such material just destroyed the old texts and what a shame

What a disaster

Submitting....

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