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For Noah - once again with respect

Reader comment on item: How the West Could Lose
in response to reader comment: You're just not seeing the full picture

Submitted by Michel C. Zala (United States), Jan 14, 2007 at 00:16

By now I have a drink next to the keyboard, haha.

sounds almost apologetic for them. Look...if the evils of Islam have been laid bare with no reservation and no sugar-coating, and the so-called "moderate" Muslims turn away for that reason, then that makes them part of the problem. Their inaction is precisely what paints them in the same picture as the radicals. If any so-called "moderate" Muslims are reading this forum, then it is their duty...if they hope to achieve equal acceptance and reform their religion...to confront these unpleasant facts and speak out. "Turning away in resignation" is a cowardly cop-out that does nothing to improve their image.

I concede the point and agree. I am very disappointed. One slant though – I do not apologize or excuse, but simply try to find explanations. I sincerely try to abstain from all this emotion and remain polite, respectful and apply "innocent until proven guilty". Weakness or inner strength?

And I have indeed come forward with solutions to the problem. My solutions are workable, though tougher than many have the will for. But I don't see another solution.

For the record – I do not deem you as a hatemonger or one of the people who see nothing but problems but do not have ideas or offer solutions. It is why I have enjoyed this debate with you and not so much others, where some qualifications were borderline insulting on a personal level. You and I differ in general on the extent of measures with a fruitful and refreshing exchange.

As far as being emotional, we should be highly emotional about this. We are, after all, talking about the future of our country and the type of lives our children and grandchildren will be living.

Once again, we fundamentally agree and both are looking for ways to preserve our way of life in the long run. I offer a slightly different viewpoint, as far as emotion is concerned, inasmuch as I make a difference between emotionally and passionately arguing. I resent the use of absolute statements, universal character assassinations and so on. They do not serve any objective other than across the board generate resentment. You do mostly abstain of that, Noah but many posts contain borderline insulting adjectives, not prone to leading to constructive dialogue of any kind.

Gotta correct your wording there. Israel did not "turn on" the Muslims. They give Muslims far more freedoms than they have in any Muslim country. You misunderstood me, as I used your exact words " turn on them" to demonstrate, how an experienced force is not able to prevent terrorism.

I usually try to abstain from who did what first. Too dicey.

They are sleeper cells. They are waiting for a "big bang" like 9/11. Their strategy is not what you think it is.

Okay – fair enough – according to you they pursue the "migratory attack" sleeper cell approach. I accept your viewpoint, while I disagree with it, as also outlined several times. But we do agree that this will take many more generations (you mention 50- to 100 years). That is a lot of time for us as civilized world to take countermeasures to use an expression from the military/strategy vocabulary.

I deem however, as opposed to you ( if I understand you correctly) the current militant, radical Islam as clear and present danger much more than the non militant migratory and subversive movement you describe.
A) we got the means and time to implement the "revolution within the Western World
B) Terrorist objectives as presently published by Al Khaeda and the likes can be achieved within a short time, if we do not implement a more fundamental counter strategy, eliminating potential domestic breeding grounds.

And once again I ask you to point out a country where Islam is dominant or where Muslims are in large numbers, where Islamic terrorism, suppression of freedom, sexism, and all sorts of barbarity exists. Can you name me one?

No – but that does not preclude me from trying to see a distinction between Countries like Jordan or Turkey and Yemen or Syria or most of all IRAN. I have never tried to deny the aspects of the culture you describe, Noah. But I do feel that - see my post to Susan - as in Japan for instance, democracy can be exported, installed and grown. Turkey has made some undeniable progress since their barbaric times. Why not try to foster that development and an integration with western Europe? It will not hurt us, but has the potential for some success on one of the many fronts of this war, don't you agree?

Muslims are Muslims. Muslims all practice Islam. Islam is a depraved death cult. It's that simple. …So a "good Muslim" (ie one faithful to his religion) is by definition an enemy of freedom and certainly an enemy to the USA.

You have mounted a lot of evidence to that fact. Nothing I personally could deny or confirm. All I personally would have wanted is to hear from an American Muslim to that fact. How he resolves that obvious dilemma. Non factual, personal and individual feeling of mine, that there is a silent segment of modern Muslims out there, otherwise we would see much more tension here domestically than just isolated incidents.

In other words, no suicide bombings, etc. Slowly they will subvert our will and our culture, until they reach a critical mass, which is when they will resort to force. Show me the exception to this pattern, anywhere in the world. Can you do that?

Of course not, as we are not there yet. As mentioned before, I deem the Netherlands to be the first real test within the next 20 years. I still refuse to believe that they will see mass uprising or the Sharia as state law, even, if they have a majority or the so called critical mass.

"Well, if ISLAM could be seen as one integrated movement containing all three categories, they'd be ready now, as we speak, to commence large scale terrorist activities and thus destabilize the western world."See, here you are in fact the one thinking one-dimensionally. You think that just because they have the ability to exercise force, that they will. Not so. They think on multiple levels and they think far ahead. What did 9/11 result it? It resulted in the USA invading Afghanistan and deposing the Taliban and killing tons of terorrists, invading Iraq and killing tons of terrorists.

Noah - consider for a moment the truly horrific assumption, that ISLAM pursues its goals on both fronts. I would in their position.

If the militants migrate from their gigantomanismus to a low tech assault, they can have the objective of Western destabilization right now, while the non-militants pursue the silent migratory attack and officially distance themselves from the radicals with "plausible deniability". If I was them, that's exactly what I would do, integrate a short term with a long term strategy. Where our difference of opinion lays is that the evil movement as described by you to my opinion already could have started, if there was in fact so much support by domestic Muslims.

The mainstream media is so biased and so corrupt that you cannot believe anything that say these days.

I agree, inasmuch as I do not trust A N Y media at face value. I ve seen compelling and interesting conspiracy theories, incredibly well made up to that Airplane Crash back east, where they said it may have been a US Army stinger to inflame against terrorists. Nothing anyone can possibly say or write, which will make me believe that McVeigh was anything but a stupid, narcistic white supremacist with a grudge. Further believe in Occam's Razor: Some times the most plausible explanation is indeed the right one to put it into a simplistic manner.

Which simply damns them with the rest. Look, if they are so weak, so cowardly, that they cannot take control of their religion from the supposedly "minority" of 10-15% radicals, then they don't deserve to be treated any better than the radicals. They are part of the problem.

I do not deny that. As with the Germans, there is a fundamental duty of responsibility. Silence in this case makes them co-conspirators.

Or perhaps they simply don't care. Perhaps they simpy do hate America and prefer Islamic rule. Occam's razor...the simplest answer is usually the right one. Perhaps because they are Muslim, they side with Islam.

Absolutely accepted as possibility. ( I just always try to apply Habeas Corpus) And, responding to you by going paragraph by paragraph, it is ironic that I above used the very same Razor in a different context to argue one of your perspectives – I let it stand as is. A nice bit of evidence how the same methode can be applied to debate different perspectives.

Americans needed no generations to speak out...we rose from oppression to freedom from day one.

I feel, Noah, that this is comparing apples with potatoes. Mixed culture, revolutionary war, and many blacks have until only few generations not been able to "speak up". I simply see it a bit different.

Second, these supposedly intimidated, culturally programmed silent ones seem to have no problem speaking out, protesting, crying on the mainstream media news shows, and demonstrating in large numbers when we throw suspisicously acting Muslims off the plane. They had no compunction about loudly speaking out to support their Muslim candidate when he was sworn in on the Koran (while loudly chanting their death cry of "Allahu Akbar"). The only time they seem to remain silent is when it comes time to condemn terrorism.

Can you explain that paradox for us?

First of all, if memory serves me right, Allahu Akhbar means God is great. As inappropriate as any such religious yelling touches me during any inauguration, I do not see the content as inflaming. Unfortunate however that the same cry hovered over so many battlefields including my own Hungary. Secondly, behavioral patterns in masses are always different, no matter the culture.

Thirdly – condemnation of Islamic Terrorism by representatives of ISLAM is still marginal – A tragedy indeed and leads to many paranoid anti –islamists to feel confirmed in their Bias. I deplore the silence myself.

While that is indeed a small sampling, it does constitute a pretty significant number of Muslims in a rather large metropolitan area,Who can blame you, if your experiences were that bad. How can I possibly argue for a silent segment of moderate Muslims? Any personal references I make or experiences I had to the contrary will never change your mind.

To the topic of revision of freedom of speech.We fundamentally agree here too. The weight must be on enforcement and yes, that would also mean overcoming of some legal hurdles to apply – to use a nasty word - censorship. As opposed to you, I feel that it can be done and vigorously applied to any doctrine.

" You cannot "enforce" assimilation. Either a person wants to assimilate into a new host country or they do not. Forcing them to assimilate does nothing more than paint over the inherent hatred they have, and what you're left with is a seemingly normal citizen who is boiling over inside with resentment. We need to keep out those who do not willingly wish to be true Americans and remain loyal to America first and only.

Sorry, my example proves me right. Whoever comes to the host country must abide by its laws and culture. No special privileges or treatment, no ghettos, no enclaves. CH is evidence of a country where that is in place already and proves feasibility each day. What anyone thinks behind the closed doors of their homes, is not my problem and their granted liberty. But right there the buck stops.

"The school where Islamic kids work side by side with the rest or our melting pot, can so become the balancing force to any potential indoctrination at home."

It won't matter, when those Islamic kids are fed the psychotic hatred that their parents drum into them daily at the dinner table. Believe me, I've seen this in action.In today" s Double Income world and full day schools, we are looking at 10h/School vs. 3 h potential indoctrination at home – over time the liberalism as experienced at school will dominate any private hatred – Is my individual conclusion. May take a couple of generations.

They choose to do so. It's up to them to act otherwise. Instead of setting up Islamic stores catering to Muslims only, why not shop at American stores. Instead of dressing up like someone living in the deserts of Iraq, why not dress like an American? It's entirely their own fault when they choose not to assimilate.

Again not much in terms of differing of opinions. My slant is only that I believe we could enforce assimilation and do not have to leave it to the immigrant to choose to assimilate. By choosing to come to this country, that privilege is no more. Such enclaves are a socio-demographic powder keg and it should be outlawed to have stores with merchandise not labeled in English, street signs in Vietnamese or city blocks which feel like a countryside in China. We could implement such legislature. We simply haven't been forced or compelled to do so yet.

And there is the root of most of America's problems. The problem is, how do we get back to that? We're allowing far too many subversive elements to infiltrate and subvert our culture like a human cancer...Mexicans, Arabs, Muslims...and they're all loyal to their motherland and their religion above their loyalty to America. They aren't Americans. They're squatters, parasites leeching off America's lifeblood and future.

We agree again - I just see it as a cross-cultural phenomenon, not just Islam related. As mentioned – that phenomenon could be worked on many different dimensions in order to regain a sense of overall, cross- cultural patriotism.

A fire started by the PLO for propaganda purposes, with the help of revisionist history (and a template from Goebbels himself), and through the complicity of other Muslims countries.

My sole point to even mention this controversial topic was that we (Western Civilized World) are responsible for the Israel mess of the 20th century and must help clean it up. Other than that I will not touch on any claims or legalities, as we can no longer determine, what came first, the egg or the chicken.

Wrong, wrong, wrong. First, by doing all the work for another, we deprive them of freedom of choice. We absolve them of any sense of responsibility for their actions. We feed into their victimology mentality. By making it a situation where we accept responsibility for changing their behavior, we take on their job. We feed into their propaganda and in turn end up playing their game, just like the so-called "Palestinians" play Israel like a harp.

Wrong! It is their duty, their responsibility, to reform themselves. Since they refuse to do so, they must be removed from our society and denied access, aid, or compassion unless and until they change. Tough love, international style.

I don't advocate any sort of passivity. I advocate strong, immediate, uncompromising force to deal with the threat.

Fact of current circumstances: They can not be removed, they can not be denied access, and they can not be demanded to change and there is no way for practical immediate force to deal with a global movement of that magnitude. Okay – now what? Back to divide and conquer, is my only response.

My contention is that we have to remove Islam and all Muslims from our society, force them back to the lands they came from, and let them know that we simply will not tolerate their barbarity, their treachery, their whining. Let Islam survive or die in its own land under its own people. If what you and others claim is true, if only 15% of them are violent, then this would force the moderates to detsroy the radicals, reform their religion, and become a civilzed people. If they cannot do that, they are not worthy to live among us. It's that simple. If they remain cowardly and silent, then the so-called radicals will continue to rule them, and there will be a Sunni-Shia genicide war, which is fine. Perhaps when they get tired of killing one another, they will eventually turn to reform and peace. But is it not our responsibility to do so. Let them go home and work it out.

If they try exporting their violence, we simply blow them off the face of the earth. Tough love. Reform Islam or we will simply eradicate Islam.

While I appreciate, where you come from – I really understand it, Noah, non of the above solutions are even closely feasible or have any chance of being ever entertained in the world we live in. It is in light of that, that I try to find more practical ways to achieve civilized world objectives. Even the combined power of all western defense forces including China and Russia would never manage to implement such a radical MO – not with 40 % of the World population disseminated across the globe.

If that's what you believe, then you simply choose to ignore both the history and the actual teachings of Islam. And that is precisely the problem. Too few people are willing to look at history, current events, and the realities of that death cult, and tell it like it is.

I never denied their violent past nor the letter of that book.( Nor ours for that matter or some enigmatic , cryptic and easily as aggressive or at least exclusive interpretable passuses in the Bible). I advocate to clamp down hard on any violent teachings everywhere and from anyone. No exceptions!

We need to acknowledge in no uncertain terms that Islam at its very core is a violent death cult created by a violent man in order to unite a violent tribal people. We need to acknowledge that their culture is uncivilized and in drastic need of reform. We need to speak out, openly and loudly, and show how rancid and depraved all Islamic societies and countries are. We need to remove the mass psychosis called "multiculturalism" and admit that Islamic society is far inferior to American society, we need to denounce it, we need to declare it barbaric, we need to point out how corrupt and violent it is at its very core, and we need to insist on total reform. Those who forget the past are condemned to repeat it.

A bit strong tobacco for my taste. Let me rephrase one key sentence: We need to help the willing to overcome centuries of indoctrination and understand democracy as the most superior of all societies. Successful reform always came from within. In the context of an overall networked global society, what's so bad about supporting even tiny efforts to that fact?

We know the root cause. Islam. There is no question about that. The problem is that few if any are willing to face reality and admit that. You need look no further than the Koran. The religion was founded by a barbaric rapist, murderer, pedophile who founded the religion in violent terms in order to unite a violent tribal people. They spread it in a violent manner. Their holy book and auxilliary writings all endorse terror. The very name "Islam" means "submission".

See above - even, if you are 100% right, how do you want to "reform" 40 % of the World Population?
You have to slice the cake and eat it in small pieces…. A la the elephant in the fridge.

Again, you still have not explained their actions nor have you answered any of my challenges to explain them as yet. I'm still waiting.

The segment of a moderate majority amongst domestic Muslims is my diagnosis by exclusion. While I indeed have not seen or heard much from them (including here) I have yet to see proof to the contrary with much more racially founded higher level riots and such. I feel, I think and I hope that I am right – but I can not prove you wrong.

Michel, pour me a drink too! All this writing has me parched! :-)
You got it – I toast to your health.

Actually, my point was that the Muslims would see it as weak and begging. They really don't understand peaceful resolution and win/win situations. Compromises to them are weakness. They are a tribal people, and so we must "speak their language". We must communicate to them as tribal people. Tribal mentality worships force, strength, non-compromising, and hardness. That's how we must act towards them if we ever expect meaningful communication. More on this in a moment.

You guys so often tell me, how sneaky and smart they are and now, all of a sudden, win/win is a non-starter with a culture famous for its bazaar dealing and wheeling?

An unemotional response from their culture? That's like asking for hardcore raunch from an episode of Leave It To Beaver! :-DL O L - good one, I needed it. Hey – I may be naïve, and the lack of response certainly does not help either.

Certainly! It would indeed be refreshing for a Muslim scholar who is willing to speak the truth about Islam to come and give us his thoughts on how Islam might reform itself and what he thinks we can do to force them to do so. But there are so few such people that we might as well play the lottery and expect to win, literally.I agree – but rephrase according to my multi culti philo: .. and what he thinks we can do to support such efforts…

Just don't expect a cavalry of moderate Muslims to come rallying to defend Islam. If you notice, virtually all the responses by Muslims here are either inflammatory nonsense, lies and propaganda, obfuscation and evasion, or simply non-answers.

Well, I blew the horn, yet the cavalry hasn't come to my rescue. I have indeed seen a few muslijm comments and dismissed those as classic cliché responses. inasmuch the majority of submissions from the Anti-Islamic front were not very non-inflammatory either… but much better evidenced.

Lastly - time for another nightcap to avoid nightmares – You and I do not absolutely disagree. I found a lot of common ground. I disagree with you on the amplitude of the various measures, not so much on the wavelength. If that makes any sense.

Unless anything of significance or a new fresh (muslim) perspective materializes, I feel that it has been said, what can be said from the various viewpoints. I salute you all and otherwise disappear to my mumbo-jumbo planet, before I lose any remaining self-confidence ;)

If you feel the need to slam me directly, e-mail me at mczala@hotmail.com. I'd appreciate any links to moderate muslim websites and blogs so I could inform myself first hand.

Otherwise, Elvis and I have left the building.


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Title Commenter Date Thread
George Orwell : "If there was hope, it must lie in the proles." [82 words]mythJan 17, 2010 20:20167454
How the West Could Lose [168 words]AnneSep 20, 2008 10:59138894
Interesting point of view... [85 words]TousifOct 21, 2009 02:53138894
how the west could lose [78 words]jamesJun 21, 2010 23:48138894
4How the West could lose. I think you will be surprised at the final outcome. response to James. [101 words]Anne-USAJun 23, 2010 16:43138894
how the west could lost - response to Anne [67 words]jamesJun 24, 2010 01:12138894
How the West Lost- There will be evil in the last days, we expect rough times. response to James [354 words]Anne- USAJun 24, 2010 19:26138894
the left wing must be stopped and exposed [36 words]stefanoMar 4, 2008 00:21121684
The Leftwing must be stopped and exposed-----by Stephano [345 words]DebbieJul 20, 2008 10:16121684
Really America, really? [49 words]JasnaDec 26, 2008 20:14121684
SUNNI QARADAWI AND BROTHERHOOD OFFER OLIVE BRANCH TO SHIITES - IN JIHAD FOR IRAN [258 words]Sofa SogoodOct 20, 2007 12:11112001
how many more must die... before we all see ? [180 words]Phil GreendOct 6, 2007 18:51110560
We need to put aside political correctness and discuss Islam [365 words]Dennis GravesSep 11, 2007 15:22108556
counter thought... [123 words]donvanOct 18, 2007 09:24108556
1ISLAM NOT A RELIGION OF PEACE. [3 words]Nina NiaziOct 19, 2007 19:24108556
We, the People. [122 words]Linda HaslamOct 20, 2007 00:16108556
right on brother! [375 words]kid berthaNov 5, 2007 15:19108556
islam not a religon of peace [158 words]Nina niaziNov 20, 2007 10:06108556
Brits deserve it!!! [186 words]JaladhiNov 20, 2007 20:22108556
2Islam: Religion of Peace? [85 words]Linda HaslamNov 27, 2007 09:42108556
1ISLAM NOT A RELIGION OF PEACE [207 words]nina niaziDec 2, 2007 17:40108556
God's children??? [139 words]Linda HaslamDec 6, 2007 11:11108556
1Jaladhi get an education old chap! [177 words]Leven-TorresApr 14, 2008 09:04108556
1try to learn scripture first [36 words]johnMay 18, 2008 05:02108556
1Don't misquote the Qur'an please. [832 words]KeithJul 22, 2008 18:22108556
islam excuses [2162 words]paul dunnNov 28, 2008 17:42108556
don't make any illusions [122 words]SunaJan 18, 2010 15:26108556
Ignorance: a dangerous thing [78 words]HamiyetMay 6, 2012 16:07108556
The War that we are Fighting [1925 words]Major DaveMay 23, 2007 17:3894113
My average American's opinion [768 words]kid berthaJun 12, 2007 16:1994113
So what is your solution? [1942 words]Major DaveJun 12, 2007 23:5394113
misunderstood [1256 words]kid berthaJun 14, 2007 11:1894113
My Respect [341 words]MichelAug 25, 2007 15:0694113
Oh, boy......... [76 words]Nick4693Sep 13, 2007 19:5294113
ISLAM NOT A RELIGION OF PEACE. [156 words]Nina NiaziOct 19, 2007 16:3694113
1Nina is correct. [432 words]kid berthaNov 5, 2007 14:4394113
ISLAM NOT A RELIGION OF PEACE [114 words]NinaNov 7, 2007 18:1994113
bravo [110 words]kcOct 21, 2009 01:0394113
Islam is not a relgion of Peace [20 words]sahilApr 10, 2011 13:5694113
2Monotheism vs Polytheism [225 words]IndianMay 17, 2007 03:5993309
Very right but still slightly off. [140 words]True-IndianSep 22, 2007 11:2693309
what is the truth? [51 words]najeebSep 15, 2009 09:1293309
Shiites [59 words]Dr Erich MeyerMay 8, 2007 23:5892175
Why US should attack Islamic Iran now ??? [642 words]ShivaMay 4, 2007 10:1591639
1Finally a factual message has been posted [372 words]kid berthaMay 5, 2007 09:3291639
1Right on! [332 words]Nick4693Sep 13, 2007 22:5291639
there's no why! [84 words]SunaJan 18, 2010 15:3691639
Plato [302 words]SohailApr 22, 2007 06:2090156
To Sohail: All mixed up [210 words]PlatoApr 23, 2007 08:4390156
So why should the West be the winner???? [2 words]aliApr 16, 2007 10:0089384
Answers for Ali [93 words]Noah WilkApr 19, 2007 18:3889384
how i see it [74 words]warnerApr 20, 2007 01:0189384
Ali your answer is in the Taliban video [99 words]PlatoApr 22, 2007 01:5889384
Three words for you [3 words]RJMay 1, 2007 00:0889384
How the West could lose: Reply to Mr.Ali. [47 words]Jaisingh ThakurJul 13, 2007 00:1689384
Why [35 words]aliJul 21, 2007 14:3489384
No... [93 words]adfJul 20, 2008 15:1789384
1why most of iranian hate arabs and islam? [17 words]persianDec 16, 2008 17:3189384
iranians hate arabs [4 words]joeSep 11, 2009 17:5189384
To Be the Big Dog or Not [628 words]MichaelApr 11, 2007 11:4989023
A muslim duty [581 words]moderate MuslimApr 7, 2007 00:0088762
Reality check and fantasy [50 words]dhimmi no moreApr 7, 2007 18:1488762
make no sense [14 words]moderate MuslimApr 8, 2007 22:2288762
Yes I read it in Arabic a language that you do not know [27 words]dhimmi no moreApr 9, 2007 18:0988762
Honest answers, please! [343 words]Nick4693Sep 11, 2007 19:5788762
Now one question [106 words]moderate MuslimApr 6, 2007 23:3388757
M&M and his bogus context again and Q9:4 or 5 if you wish [53 words]dhimmi no moreApr 7, 2007 18:5188757
i dont even know [228 words]a muslim americanMar 27, 2007 22:1888086
Our dear M&M and Islamic meltdown part deux [19 words]dhimmi no moreMar 28, 2007 17:1588086
1A NORMAL MUSLIM... [341 words]DONVANApr 5, 2007 14:0488086
oil and water [86 words]todd morrisonOct 16, 2007 23:2588086
wow.... [51 words]moderate MuslimMar 27, 2007 15:3388065
It says ya ayuha al-nass! [105 words]dhimmi no moreMar 29, 2007 17:5788065
dhimmi, READ YOUR OWN EVIDENCE FIRST [225 words]moderate MuslimMar 30, 2007 19:3088065
For Our dear M&M and his bogus arabic and the Qur'an really says that islam is the religion of the Arabs only and you ain't one [718 words]dhimmi no moreApr 2, 2007 19:4188065
The poor Arabic translation of Picktall another wannabe Arab! [446 words]dhimmi no moreApr 3, 2007 07:2688065
For our dear M&m and argument from silence! And Islam is indeed the religion of the Hijazi Arabs as per Q14:4 and you ain't one [30 words]dhimmi no moreApr 5, 2007 18:1488065
One more time pt 2 [243 words]moderate MuslimMar 26, 2007 19:2788016
fantasy world of islam [286 words]susanMar 28, 2007 15:2688016
Still in denial, "Moderate" Muslim [357 words]Noah WilkMar 28, 2007 16:5988016
yeah ok [26 words]moderate MuslimMar 28, 2007 19:1988016
3Why are you making excuses, Moderate Muslim? [322 words]Noah WilkMar 31, 2007 17:5688016
were you at the rallies? [40 words]susanApr 1, 2007 10:0388016
Ok, so What? [11 words]moderate MuslimApr 2, 2007 19:0388016
the usual cheap excuse [11 words]susanApr 3, 2007 02:5688016
Ignorance is no excuse [168 words]Noah WilkApr 5, 2007 14:5188016
I will not stand for hate. [42 words]moderate MuslimApr 6, 2007 23:3688016
Moderate Muslim corners himself! [393 words]Noah WilkApr 7, 2007 16:2488016
Misunderstanding [311 words]moderate MuslimApr 7, 2007 21:1588016
easy [51 words]susanApr 8, 2007 07:1888016
the 1960's [27 words]moderate MuslimApr 8, 2007 22:2488016
not an "image" problem [297 words]susanApr 9, 2007 07:2088016
Speaking of hate and the Qur'an [83 words]dhimmi no moreApr 9, 2007 18:1988016
Why not burn effigies? [80 words]Noah WilkApr 9, 2007 20:5288016
noah [62 words]moderate MuslimApr 10, 2007 21:4888016
Back to Morous (12 seconds on the shot clock) [3677 words]moderate MuslimMar 25, 2007 22:1287974
Our dear M&M and cut and paste jobs Paki/Arabic and the bogus hadith! [522 words]dhimmi no moreMar 27, 2007 20:2387974
an addendum and my source for the hadith literary criticism [20 words]dhimmi no moreMar 28, 2007 07:0687974
My compliments to the sheik (morous 360 dunk in moderate's face, the crowd goes wild) [1370 words]MOROUSMar 28, 2007 16:3987974
To Moderate Muslim: [894 words]PlatoMar 30, 2007 04:2287974
No, I respect many [89 words]moderate MuslimMar 30, 2007 19:2587974
To Moderate Muslim: But Allah hates other religions [234 words]PlatoApr 1, 2007 02:0587974
numbers matter [54 words]susanApr 1, 2007 10:1387974
Here's your answer Plato [129 words]moderate MuslimApr 2, 2007 19:0987974
heh, ok right, that is so bogus [40 words]moderate MuslimApr 2, 2007 19:2487974
let's start from... [46 words]susanApr 3, 2007 03:1587974
And speaking of bogus! [86 words]dhimmi no moreApr 4, 2007 17:2987974
your answer [535 words](moderate) Muslim (though all real Muslims are moderate)Apr 5, 2007 22:0887974
christian arabs are first victims of muslims [243 words]susanApr 8, 2007 07:2687974
Islam and Terror [1398 words]moderate Muslim AmericanMar 22, 2007 17:4387720
Hamza Yusuf a Muslim scholar? LOL! [187 words]dhimmi no moreMar 23, 2007 19:2287720
2Nothing's more fun than debunking "Muslim Logic" [2959 words]Noah WilkMar 23, 2007 21:1887720
To Moderate Muslim: It is just a wish-list you have given us [2577 words]PlatoMar 24, 2007 06:4087720
M&M and David Chappelle exposed [147 words]dhimmi no moreMar 25, 2007 09:1487720
high muslim clerics agree with bin laden [394 words]susanMar 27, 2007 15:2487720
ok? [44 words]moderate Muslim-Mar 27, 2007 22:0087720
you just proved how ignorant islamphobes are [82 words]Islamophobic ignoranceMar 28, 2007 15:2687720
Precisely why we condemn you [380 words]Noah WilkMar 28, 2007 17:1887720
The little olive institute [32 words]dhimmi no moreMar 28, 2007 17:4587720
Our dear M&M and Yusuf Hamza's ancestry [25 words]dhimmi no moreMar 28, 2007 17:5187720
thanks.. [8 words]moderate MuslimMar 28, 2007 19:2087720
Islamophobia, really? [298 words]dhimmi no moreMar 29, 2007 07:2287720
Because , the most comfortable position for a coward is to struggle to be portrayed a "moderate" (&) Moslem. [611 words]Ynna(tchkah)Mar 29, 2007 13:4087720
poor reply [71 words]susanMar 29, 2007 13:4287720
like you said something... [91 words]susanMar 29, 2007 13:5087720
we need ears to listen and eyes to see [252 words]Islamophobia no more...Mar 29, 2007 16:3887720
chechnya is sufi [20 words]susanApr 1, 2007 10:1487720
I dont think you get it (Ynna (tchkah) [129 words]moderate MuslimApr 2, 2007 19:2387720
and why? [41 words]moderate MuslimApr 2, 2007 19:2787720
Our dear Islamophobia no more and his little diatribes [48 words]dhimmi no moreApr 2, 2007 19:5487720
Congratulations for not going to work to CAIR [108 words]Ynna (tchkah)Apr 3, 2007 03:0287720
skewed perception of Islamophobes [138 words]Islamophobia no moreApr 3, 2007 03:0387720
africa's fault is african [146 words]susanApr 3, 2007 03:2287720
an Islamophobe [259 words]Islamophobia no moreApr 3, 2007 03:3287720
cair wants sharia [39 words]susanApr 3, 2007 03:3987720
More diatribes from our dear INM aka M&M [103 words]dhimmi no moreApr 3, 2007 18:4387720
YOU DON'T GET THE POINT [19 words]moderate MuslimApr 3, 2007 20:2787720
For our dear INM and what is an Islamophobe part deux [343 words]dhimmi no moreApr 4, 2007 07:5387720
no matter how you turn it [67 words]susanApr 4, 2007 14:5187720
nobody is irrationally vilifying islam [234 words]susanApr 4, 2007 15:0887720
sharia allows slavery [18 words]susanApr 4, 2007 17:3987720
Dropping names and Si, comprende mucho! [111 words]dhimmi no moreApr 4, 2007 17:4887720
fallacy of bias history-reading [108 words]Islamophobia no moreApr 5, 2007 01:5987720
islamophobia, the stupidest word ever invented [124 words]susanApr 5, 2007 16:3087720
Cair and other people [171 words]moderate MuslimApr 5, 2007 22:1587720
CAIR [374 words]Noah WilkApr 6, 2007 14:5587720
Why then do you support it? [290 words]Noah WilkApr 6, 2007 15:0387720
cair = sharia = stone age [70 words]susanApr 6, 2007 15:1987720
Noah [124 words]moderate MuslimApr 6, 2007 23:4087720
M&M CAIR (big time LOL) and his flawed logic! [344 words]dhimmi no moreApr 7, 2007 08:3787720
Yes, Moderate Muslim, you ARE responsible! [516 words]Noah WilkApr 7, 2007 16:4587720
ROTFL [44 words]dhimmi no moreApr 7, 2007 18:3787720
al-Shari3a [10 words]dhimmi no moreApr 7, 2007 18:3987720
CAIR and mockery [26 words]dhimmi no moreApr 8, 2007 11:4087720
i'll see [37 words]moderate MuslimApr 8, 2007 22:3487720
Why aren't moderate muslims standing up? [55 words]Bob SterlingAug 20, 2007 23:5187720
why should the west win anyways if it continues with its current programme of warmongering? [434 words]cocoMay 6, 2009 12:0187720
islam & terror [627 words]John EdwardsOct 27, 2009 15:1387720
so here are you answers more if you want em [29 words]moderate MuslimMar 20, 2007 19:3287302
Moderate Muslim fails again! [1415 words]Noah WilkMar 21, 2007 15:3287302
mauritania has got legal slavery, allowed in islam [15 words]susanMar 21, 2007 16:5787302
MM [230 words]JaladhiMar 21, 2007 18:0187302
handshake with Kuffar? "Muslim debate schemes" and other sordid matters! [599 words]dhimmi no moreMar 22, 2007 07:5187302
morocco 50% literacy rate [18 words]susanMar 22, 2007 10:0387302
"Muslim debate schemes"! part deux [452 words]dhimmi no moreMar 24, 2007 14:1087302
Dhimmi No More - defenders of the faith have left town!!! [40 words]JaladhiMar 26, 2007 16:5687302
Your answer Plato (which is a really bad name for you, because it dishonores someone who actually thought [169 words]Moderate MuslimMar 20, 2007 19:1887298
Was the post for me? [45 words]PlatoMar 21, 2007 08:3087298
Try paying attention, Moderate Muslim [570 words]Noah WilkMar 21, 2007 17:5587298
blatantly clear? LOL [178 words]dhimmi no moreMar 21, 2007 19:5087298
To MM: Would Mohammed be a good name for me? [130 words]PlatoMar 22, 2007 14:0087298
you guys hate the truth, dontcha [23 words]moderate MuslimMar 22, 2007 17:1087298
clarification [36 words]Moderate MuslimMar 22, 2007 17:1287298
No, Im not beyond help, although I dont need much [73 words]moderate MuslimMar 22, 2007 17:1587298
Free will in islam? LOL [379 words]dhimmi no moreMar 24, 2007 08:1587298
you like lies don'tcha? [148 words]susanMar 25, 2007 10:2187298
To Syed [17 words]moderate MuslimMar 16, 2007 19:3086570
LOL syed is asking for caliphate [8 words]susanMar 18, 2007 10:1686570
Syed? LOL He has no credibility! [172 words]dhimmi no moreMar 18, 2007 12:5086570
Syeds are not Iranians?? [83 words]JaladhiMar 19, 2007 17:1886570
What? [35 words]moderate MuslimMar 19, 2007 19:2486570
For our dear M&M and islam [73 words]dhimmi no moreMar 20, 2007 17:4886570
To Moderate Muslim: Spreading Islam by avoiding unpleasant facts [389 words]PlatoMar 22, 2007 13:3586570
Sure, Syed's the perfect choice [230 words]JeffMar 27, 2007 18:2386570
i wasnt..... [77 words]moderate MuslimMar 27, 2007 22:0286570
THE JOKE'S ON YOU (DHIMMI) [32 words]moderate MuslimMar 16, 2007 19:2786568
And your point is? [244 words]dhimmi no moreMar 18, 2007 12:4086568
You dont know me, you dont even care [110 words]moderate MuslimMar 19, 2007 19:3686568
avoiding the sex slaves matter [52 words]susanMar 20, 2007 16:1186568
Uno Questiono por legion of doom [36 words]moderate MuslimMar 16, 2007 19:2586566
To Moderate Muslim: Global warming a belief? [63 words]PlatoMar 17, 2007 23:1186566
The Official Stance of the Legion of Doom On Global Warming [59 words]Noah WilkMar 18, 2007 10:1786566
youre just not answering [43 words]moderate MuslimMar 19, 2007 19:2986566
heheh, thanks plato [25 words]moderate MuslimMar 19, 2007 19:3086566
You were indeed given an answer [209 words]Noah WilkMar 20, 2007 15:2986566
They're not scared [107 words]Noah WilkMar 20, 2007 15:3686566
sex slaves conspiracy [101 words]susanMar 20, 2007 16:1486566
?? [72 words]moderate MuslimMar 22, 2007 17:1986566
Yes, you are on trial [223 words]Noah WilkMar 23, 2007 18:5786566
islam is not on trial, it's already convicted [14 words]susanMar 25, 2007 10:2686566
heh please [45 words]moderate MuslimMar 26, 2007 19:1686566
Spain and Arabian imperialism and justifying the absurd [69 words]dhimmi no moreMar 27, 2007 20:4886566
spain? islam flourished? [2978 words]susanMar 28, 2007 02:5786566
Islam is peace [103 words]moderate MuslimMar 14, 2007 21:3686334
disproved [331 words]susanMar 15, 2007 16:2486334
Islam and violence and silence [116 words]dhimmi no moreMar 18, 2007 17:3486334
uh NO [7 words]moderate MuslimMar 19, 2007 19:2586334
Our dear M&M has never been to a madrassa! [81 words]dhimmi no moreMar 24, 2007 14:2286334
ALARMING NEWS - POLYGAMOUS MUSLIM IMMIGRANTS ARE WELCOME IN US WITH UP TO FOUR WIVES [211 words]Sofa SogoodMar 14, 2007 14:4586290
A Peaceful Muslim Country (oh my) [259 words]moderate MuslimMar 11, 2007 21:2185929
...muslim [492 words]susanMar 12, 2007 18:3085929
very poor example [255 words]susanMar 12, 2007 18:4085929
Dave Chapelle? and who the heck is he? And why should we like him or hate him for this matter [235 words]dhimmi no moreMar 12, 2007 19:3985929
MALAYSIA A PEACEFUL MUSLIM COUNTRY???LOL [110 words]MOROUSMar 13, 2007 16:5385929
Malaysia is Saudi Arabia of East [142 words]JaladhiMar 13, 2007 19:1385929
Talking points, pillars, quibbles, quotes, examples, and some words of wisdom from the kennedys. [972 words]moderate MuslimMar 13, 2007 19:3285929
MY EMAILS? [13 words]muslimMar 13, 2007 21:2385929
Malaysia is Saudi Arabia of East - Pt. 2 [133 words]JaladhiMar 14, 2007 16:2785929
The good ole pillars of islam! [84 words]dhimmi no moreMar 14, 2007 16:4385929
kennedy quote? [659 words]susanMar 14, 2007 16:4485929
why does everyone not get it [32 words]moderate MuslimMar 14, 2007 19:4085929
huh?? [339 words]morousMar 15, 2007 12:2285929
Our dear M&M and you ain't Muqatil [61 words]dhimmi no moreMar 15, 2007 20:0485929
To Morous-Clarify a few things [291 words]moderate MuslimMar 15, 2007 21:2585929
your clarification Moderate [664 words]MorousMar 17, 2007 11:4685929
one clarification: malaysia has got sharia law [41 words]susanMar 18, 2007 10:1985929
literal interpretation [68 words]susanMar 18, 2007 10:2285929
Reply to Reply : morous [116 words]moderate MuslimMar 18, 2007 17:1585929
women as humans? [31 words]susanMar 20, 2007 04:5185929
It's Back in your court MODERATE [616 words]MorousMar 20, 2007 13:2585929
Malaysia? [171 words]surjApr 20, 2007 22:3485929
More Answers (Aisha) (ra) [2787 words]moderate MuslimMar 11, 2007 21:0685919
aisha the child [103 words]susanMar 12, 2007 18:3385919
To Moderate Muslim: Hiding the shame of Aisha's age and a Maulana abrogates 9:29 [989 words]PlatoMar 13, 2007 01:1385919
3A'isha and real history! and playing with dolls! [648 words]dhimmi no moreMar 13, 2007 07:2885919
Lies will not change historical age of Aisha at the time of her marriage [157 words]JaladhiMar 20, 2007 15:4385919
The Ultimate Post- No Hiding, No Crying, Just Answers [8353 words]moderate MuslimMar 8, 2007 22:1385330
I'm cherry picking Moderate Muslim's huge post [2178 words]Noah WilkMar 9, 2007 04:1485330
For our dear M&M and his bogus command of Islamic theology [454 words]dhimmi no moreMar 9, 2007 18:0085330
To Moderate Muslim: Ethical basis of Islam and the thrashing of women by men [2001 words]PlatoMar 10, 2007 07:3085330
For our dear Moderate Msulim and what is really a moderate Muslim?And other sordid matters [885 words]dhimmi no moreMar 10, 2007 07:4085330
More Answers-To Dhimmi [293 words]moderate MuslimMar 10, 2007 13:2085330
Our dear M&M and he is really a "bait"? and Jihad or holy war revisited part deux [653 words]dhimmi no moreMar 10, 2007 14:1585330
moderate [592 words]susanMar 10, 2007 15:0185330
For our dear M&M and Q2:216 ...part one! [832 words]dhimmi no moreMar 11, 2007 09:2885330
dhimmi ... [26 words]susanMar 11, 2007 10:3985330
For our dear M&M and Q9:4 part deux! [541 words]dhimmi no moreMar 11, 2007 14:4185330
moderate Muslim [61 words]moderate MuslimMar 11, 2007 17:4285330
Condemnable Offenses. Controlling Men [91 words]moderate MuslimMar 11, 2007 17:4585330
you have no idea what a race is again [13 words]susanMar 12, 2007 03:3885330
M&M and more fantasy [262 words]dhimmi no moreMar 12, 2007 07:5285330
To Moderate Muslim: Fight to make your neighbours submit to Allah [179 words]PlatoMar 12, 2007 10:1585330
response to moderate muslim [555 words]morousMar 12, 2007 16:2585330
invented by modern people? [111 words]susanMar 12, 2007 18:3085330
yeah, so? [97 words]moderate MuslimMar 12, 2007 19:2485330
To Moderate Muslim: On rape and chopping off hands [583 words]PlatoMar 12, 2007 23:1885330
Uh no [17 words]moderate MuslimMar 13, 2007 19:3385330
the joke is on you morous [36 words]moderate MuslimMar 13, 2007 19:3685330
Hypocritical Muslim [56 words]Noah WilkMar 13, 2007 20:4385330
origins [183 words]dhimmi no moreMar 13, 2007 21:5885330
Racism! Really? [147 words]dhimmi no moreMar 14, 2007 12:3185330
i am 100% correct [57 words]susanMar 14, 2007 16:2285330
More evidence [47 words]dhimmi no moreMar 14, 2007 16:5685330
Hypocrisy - thy name is.... [46 words]JaladhiMar 14, 2007 17:3185330
Jesus is god? [26 words]moderate muslimMar 14, 2007 19:3185330
not quite making sense - at all [129 words]moderate MuslimMar 14, 2007 19:3785330
lies [30 words]moderate MuslimMar 14, 2007 19:3885330
His words? [226 words]dhimmi no moreMar 15, 2007 07:3985330
Muslims suppress free debate on anti Semitism at Leeds University, UK [163 words]DelboyMar 15, 2007 09:4985330
MM [135 words]susanMar 15, 2007 16:1485330
2My dear M&M and i'm glad that you asked and the Qur'an really says that Jesus is God! [93 words]dhimmi no moreMar 15, 2007 19:5985330
Uh what? [38 words]moderate MuslimMar 16, 2007 19:2185330
MM - Read Dhimmi No More's(who knows Arabic) posts to understand Q9:4 [92 words]JaladhiMar 19, 2007 17:4885330
Respond to what? [58 words]dhimmi no moreMar 19, 2007 20:1485330
For our dear M&M and the Qur'an really says that jesus is God and the bogus tawheed [140 words]dhimmi no moreMar 20, 2007 07:5185330
THAT'S NOT WHAT THE KORAN SAYS [22 words]MOROUSMar 20, 2007 14:0285330
The fundamentally faulty logic of the person called dhimmi no more [201 words]moderate MuslimMar 20, 2007 19:0185330
Astaghfirullah is M&M's lame answer [239 words]dhimmi no moreMar 23, 2007 07:2885330
Flat? Hardly [31 words]Moderate MuslimMar 25, 2007 21:5385330
ONCE AGAIN MODERATE, THE KORAN CONTRADICTS YOU [172 words]MOROUSMar 28, 2007 17:0885330
Hand Chopping and Adultery [74 words]Mukhtar Ahmed KashifJul 30, 2009 12:4785330
Why I am proud to be a member of the Legion of Doom! [354 words]Noah WilkMar 8, 2007 21:0985321
The wake up call [15 words]Moderate MuslimFeb 26, 2007 16:2579077
You're talking, but you're not saying anything, Moderate Muslim [499 words]Noah WilkFeb 26, 2007 20:3579077
PEACEFUL NATION? YEAH, COMPARED TO THE HUNS [53 words]Moderate MuslimFeb 28, 2007 07:3279077
homework for moderate muslim [155 words]susanFeb 28, 2007 15:3479077
MM, you very well described actions of Muslims [98 words]JaladhiFeb 28, 2007 17:4279077
mob muslim contradiction [97 words]susanFeb 28, 2007 18:1079077
to mod.muslim [145 words]AnnaFeb 28, 2007 19:3479077
Susan [507 words]Moderate MuslimFeb 28, 2007 20:3479077
For our dear M&M and more fantasy [371 words]dhimmi no moreMar 1, 2007 06:0279077
peace.. [125 words]donvanMar 1, 2007 09:1879077
YES [87 words]Moderate MuslimMar 1, 2007 19:5079077
Strive to forgive what? [15 words]dhimmi no moreMar 2, 2007 17:2279077
don't believe you [65 words]susanMar 3, 2007 12:4879077
Response to Susan [153 words]moderate MuslimMar 5, 2007 20:0779077
educated fanatics.. [14 words]donvanMar 6, 2007 15:0079077
Anti-Semitic propaganda from our "Moderate" Muslim [340 words]Noah WilkMar 7, 2007 12:5179077
so many mistakes again [263 words]susanMar 7, 2007 15:0279077
NOT ANTI-SEMITIC [177 words]moderate muslimMar 7, 2007 17:4279077

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