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Attributes an Agenda:Response toTovey

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in response to reader comment: Clarification of Attributes

Submitted by Nura (United States), Oct 19, 2008 at 02:15

It's amazing that those who study the Bible cling to the words of it's translation as if the English represent the exact meaning of the word. Just like the "Holy Ghost" The son was used for many people in the Bible! Despite this common error, I have no trouble believing that Jesus was prophesized in the Old Testament. This is nothing knew.

Isiah 10

10Again the LORD spoke to Ahaz, 11"Aska sign of the LORD your God; let it be deep as Sheol or high as heaven." 12But Ahaz said, "I will not ask, and I will not put the LORD to the test." 13And he said, "Hear then, O house of David! Is it too little for you to weary men, that you weary my God also? 14Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign. Behold, the virgin shall conceive and bear a son, and shall call his nameImmanuel.15He shall eat curds and honey when he knows how to refuse the evil and choose the good. 16 For before the boy knows how to refuse the evil and choose the good, the land whose two kings you dread will bedeserted. 17 The LORD will bring upon you and upon your people and upon your father's house such days as have not come since the day that Ephraim departed from Judah—the king of Assyria."

Jesus is called the son of whom? It has been interpreted that he was called the "son of David" and the "son of man"


38Forwhoever is ashamed of me and of my words in thisadulterous and sinful generation, of him will the Son of Man also be ashamed when he comes in the glory of his Father with the holy angels."

It is also argued that Jesus was not the son of David. I have actually heard this argument quite a few times. From a Jewish perspective he isn't because he is not of the blood line of David, more like an adopted line through his stepfather. I have heard that this prophecy pertains to Moses. As Muslims, we must believe that Jesus is the prophesied messiah that was mentioned in the Torah. I don't trust the Bible enough to specifically say that he is the one referred to as the son of David for both sides, Jews and Christians, have had agendas in proving that he was either not the Messiah, or was the Messiah. It is noteworthy that there is an argument that Jews referred to all their Prophets as Messiah. In short, Jews did not believe that Jesus is Immanuel.

By agenda, I mean that Christians are so desperate at trying to rectify their dogmatic view of the trinity with the Old Testament, that there are attempts to re-interpret prior versus to support their claim. The Bible is clearly contradictory in it's attributes of Jesus. Mark, Luke, John, and Mathew, attempted to interpret prior versus of the Old Testament to validate Jesus' claim to the throne. When referring to the Old Testament, Jesus is interpreted as the son of man and David; however, the New Testament implies that he in the divine son of God. This great leap is unique to the Abrahamic faith. The only time you will see a divine son of God is when the Jews were influenced by the Babylonians and worshiped Baal. Why is this not a clue that something is wrong with the doctrine of the trinity? I will never understand how intelligent beings can believe such a thing.

I will offer an answer for considerartion. Corruption! As the Jews were influenced by the Babylonians, early Christians were influenced by the Romans, Egyptians, Babylonians, and Greeks. It was in fact a pagan king who "converted" to Christianity who sealed this doctrine. Anyone who did not agree with the doctrine was killed making it one of the greatest scandals in History.

Why is this explanation is not a possibility in the mind of Christians I will never understand! It's Clear!

*Return to the Unitarian view of God that is the heritage of Christianity before it was corrupted.

Few sources on Jesus in Islam….

Narrated Abu Huraira:

Allah's Apostle said, "By Him in Whose Hands my soul is, surely (Jesus,) the son of Mary will soon descend amongst you and will judge mankind justly (as a Just Ruler); he will break the Cross and kill the pigs and there will be no Jizya (i.e. taxation taken from non Muslims). Money will be in abundance so that nobody will accept it, and a single prostration to Allah (in prayer) will be better than the whole world and whatever is in it." Abu Huraira added "If you wish, you can recite (this verse of the Holy Book): -- 'And there is none Of the people of the Scriptures (Jews and Christians) But must believe in him (i.e Jesus as an Apostle of Allah and a human being) Before his death. And on the Day of Judgment He will be a witness Against them." (4.159) (See Fateh Al Bari, Page 302 Vol 7)

Narrated Abu Huraira:

Allah's Apostle said "How will you be when the son of Mary (i.e. Jesus) descends amongst you and he will judge people by the Law of the Quran and not by the law of Gospel (Fateh-ul Bari page 304 and 305 Vol 7)

Narrated Abu Huraira:

I heard Allah's Apostle saying, "I am the nearest of all the people to the son of Mary, and all the prophets are paternal brothers, and there has been no prophet between me and him (i.e. Jesus)."


Narrated Abdullah:

The Prophet mentioned the Massiah Ad-Dajjal in front of the people saying, Allah is not one eyed while Messsiah, Ad-Dajjal is blind in the right eye and his eye looks like a bulging out grape. While sleeping near the Ka'ba last night, I saw in my dream a man of brown color the best one can see amongst brown color and his hair was long that it fell between his shoulders. His hair was lank and water was dribbling from his head and he was placing his hands on the shoulders of two men while circumambulating the Kaba. I asked, 'Who is this?' They replied, 'This is Jesus, son of Mary.' Behind him I saw a man who had very curly hair and was blind in the right eye, resembling Ibn Qatan (i.e. an infidel) in appearance. He was placing his hands on the shoulders of a person while performing Tawaf around the Ka'ba. I asked, 'Who is this? 'They replied, 'The Masih, Ad-Dajjal.' "

Narrated Abu Huraira:

The Prophet said, "I met Moses on the night of my Ascension to heaven." The Prophet then described him saying, as I think, "He was a tall person with lank hair as if he belonged to the people of the tribe of Shanu's.' The Prophet further said, "I met Jesus." The Prophet described him saying, "He was one of moderate height and was red-faced as if he had just come out of a bathroom. I saw Abraham whom I resembled more than any of his children did." The Prophet further said, "(That night) I was given two cups; one full of milk and the other full of wine. I was asked to take either of them which I liked, and I took the milk and drank it. On that it was said to me, 'You have taken the right path (religion). If you had taken the wine, your (Muslim) nation would have gone astray."

A word indeed…

Narrated 'Ubada:

The Prophet said, "If anyone testifies that None has the right to be worshipped but Allah Alone Who has no partners, and that Muhammad is His Slave and His Apostle, and that Jesus is Allah's Slave and His Apostle and His Word which He bestowed on Mary and a Spirit created by Him, and that Paradise is true, and Hell is true, Allah will admit him into Paradise with the deeds which he had done even if those deeds were few." (Junada, the sub-narrator said, " 'Ubada added, 'Such a person can enter Paradise through any of its eight gates he likes.")


Narrated 'Ali:

I heard the Prophet saying, "Mary, the daughter of 'Imran, was the best among the women (of the world of her time) and Khadija is the best amongst the women. (of this nation)."

A Prayer for the decedents of Mary!

Narrated Said bin Al-Musaiyab:

Abu Huraira said, "I heard Allah's Apostle saying, 'There is none born among the off-spring of Adam, but Satan touches it. A child therefore, cries loudly at the time of birth because of the touch of Satan, except Mary and her child." Then Abu Huraira recited: "And I seek refuge with You for her and for her offspring from the outcast Satan" (3.36)


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