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Submitted by Kal-EL (India), Jun 6, 2006 at 03:13

I am deeply hurt to see the hatred amongst you all. When in a debate please keep ur heart and mind separate, and be ready for any possibility. Let me tell you that even if someone boasts that she/he is secular, and I mean in the context of this thread, he/she is not. At least it is what seems to me. Being secular is very hard. You can't take affinity towards any religion. And i mean any, as it is the basic definition of being secular. all of you seem to be learned students of science (if you believe), then you should know that any book coming from anywhere has to be written by someone, so discuss in that pretext and win the discussion. please make a note that advocating science doesn't make believe that God(whatever name you want to give) doesn't exists.

If there is someone better than E=MC*C, then please give me the absolute origin of this world (it's all relative). so unless proven (absolute begining of this world defined), God does exist. How many in numbers?? Nobody has seen. So at least One!!! (mathematical postulation). I have read many forums today (i just took some time out from my computer research today) , and they were affinitive to different kinds of religion. Make sure that if you follow someone's (a theologian) readings he/she is expert in both the sides. The one favourable (or favorable in US) and the other religion. Then please apply your minds too.

I am not religious. Let me be clear. But I can't deny existence of God. Religions are made by us, they are accepted by us. Every religion has some faults. Like in India (I am an Indian citizen) when we discuss which religion came first, it is taken by fact that it is Hinduism (let's assume it is). Then the problem starts, who then promoted polyandry (pandavas), or polygyny. etc. The religion which came first. It still exists in many parts of rural and urban India. When it comes to divorce the Islamic religion fails due to the misunderstood (or rather ambiguous) policies of so called sects. Then there is so called Sati (widows thrown (can be argued) to fire) in Hinduism. Recent state government not so long ago (a year ago) made a temple at the same place where one woman turned sati. I am sorry that my picture presents India in bad taste, but I can only write what I have seen. There are many lacunae on both sides of religion.

As far as being enlightened is concerned let me tell you that it is a myth. My friends many of whom are MBAs, MCAs, Engineers, Doctors have asked (imperatively) for dowry (exchange of money for marrying a woman), and some of them have rejected marriage proposals (yes in India we don't fall in love, parents do it for us... I'll come to it soon) because they didn't get acceptable amounts. Poor parents of those girls. Dowry amount spans to thousands of dollars.

Who are we fooling about acceptance of faiths and religions. We here are endogamous, even to fall in love one asks you, what is ur religion? Hindu, Muslim, Christian.... "My Lord I love her/him" (only if other is of same religion, then caste, then sub-caste...) etc etc.. Love sees traits (and not something that a person was born with; even if she/he would like to change it doesn't matter to them!!!!) Give me a break. Where is love in any religion. This is true for 98% of Indian population, and it is a fact.

One can't buy houses even in hip cities like Mumbai(Bombay) unless he/she is Gujrati, Marathi, Hindu, Muslim etc. You need to satisfy the residents' religion, caste formality. You need to fall into their "groups".

One more thing that amuses me is even though We live in one Country, we still are separated as being from UP, Maharashtra etc. People with one group (states within India) will give preference to the same group. The first thing we ask is not how is your name pronounced, but rather what's ur last name? Oh!! so you are a Hindu, a muslim, OK from Gujrat. blah blah blah....

OK now about democracy. People who allegedly burt a train bogey were prosecuted. But ones who burnt down 1000 houses and raped women were not. Just because that "sect" of people don't amount to majority religion.

Mr. Stains is murdered because so called one psycho feels he is converting tribals to christianity kills him. And the group involved in it goes scott free. Even after him admitting that he killed stains. Man if you can't give bread to poor at least tell others to. A man will convert to anything for food. If you are so attracted to your religion then you give them food. (you being any religion) If you can't at least don't let those people die of hunger. He gave them food and medicine.

So see how much separation keeps us from being secular, or rational. Bush was right to go after Osama. But what's he doing now??? Is he still after him? He brought down Iraq, killed his own armymen, killed 1000 innocents, but where is one man "Osama". He had said it was his God that asked him to attack. Give me a break. So he means to say that God was wrong in telling you that Iraq had WMDs. He sounds crazy!!!

OK, so if US is rational and secular, and forward (which I think it is) then why is Bush in his second term???

Man!!! choose the same party if you want to, just bring that crazy man out of control. I bet within a year there is one more war. This time with Iran. If we are so enlightened then why don't we fuze our nukes before we ask someone else to. Asking them is right, but what about our nukes? Hypocrisy. Not expected from a geart nation like US. I admit it it is great, but sometimes it makes me ponder!!!!

Luv to all,
Kal-EL

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