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Fascism and liberalism
Reader comment on item: Fascism's Legacy: Liberalism

Submitted by Donald W. Bales (United States), Jan 10, 2008 at 15:19

Fascism in Italy was headed by Benito Mussolini-a Socialist editor.
Franco was the Falangist in Spain.
Hitler was the head of the Nazis in Germany. National Socialist Party
They were dubbed right wing because they opposed the Communists in Germany and in Spain.

However, they were all statists or collectivists and opposed to individual rights or freedoms. It was more a case of which group of thugs would get in charge. All were opposed to representative government although Hitler used representative government to obtain power. Nothing that he did was against German laws, but the Reichtag passed any laws that he wanted passed.

I used the term thugs to describe the Taleban and Dr. Szabo took me to task for it. It is my understanding the the word "Thug" is used in India to refer to the members of a religious group who ;believe in murdering people.

And all those groups that I referred to above surely did believe in murder. I think the Communists were better at it than the Nazis, the Falangists or the Fascists though.

Conflicts since 1950 with over 10,000 Fatalities*
1 40,000,000 Red China, 1949-76 (outright killing, manmade famine, Gulag)
2 10,000,000 Soviet Bloc: late Stalinism, 1950-53; post-Stalinism, to 1987 (mostly Gulag)
3 4,000,000 Ethiopia, 1962-92: Communists, artificial hunger, genocides
4 3,800,000 Zaire (Congo-Kinshasa): 1967-68; 1977-78; 1992-95; 1998-present
5 2,800,000 Korean war, 1950-53
6 1,900,000 Sudan, 1955-72; 1983-2006 (civil wars, genocides)
7 1,870,000 Cambodia: Khmer Rouge 1975-79; civil war 1978-91
8 1,800,000 Vietnam War, 1954-75
9 1,800,000 Afghanistan: Soviet and internecine killings, Taliban 1980-2001
10 1,250,000 West Pakistan massacres in East Pakistan (Bangladesh 1971)
11 1,100,000 Nigeria, 1966-79 (Biafra); 1993-present
12 1,100,000 Mozambique, 1964-70 (30,000) + after retreat of Portugal 1976-92
13 1,000,000 Iran-Iraq-War, 1980-88
14 900,000 Rwanda genocide, 1994
15 875,000 Algeria: against France 1954-62 (675,000); between Islamists and the government 1991-2006 (200,000)
16 850,000 Uganda, 1971-79; 1981-85; 1994-present
17 650,000 Indonesia: Marxists 1965-66 (450,000); East Timor, Papua, Aceh etc, 1969-present (200,000)
18 580,000 Angola: war against Portugal 1961-72 (80,000); after Portugal's retreat (1972-2002)
19 500,000 Brazil against its Indians, up to 1999
20 430,000 Vietnam, after the war ended in 1975 (own people; boat refugees)
21 400,000 Indochina: against France, 1945-54
22 400,000 Burundi, 1959-present (Tutsi/Hutu)
23 400,000 Somalia, 1991-present
24 400,000 North Korea up to 2006 (own people)
25 300,000 Kurds in Iraq, Iran, Turkey, 1980s-1990s
26 300,000 Iraq, 1970-2003 (Saddam against minorities)
27 240,000 Columbia, 1946-58; 1964-present
28 200,000 Yugoslavia, Tito regime, 1944-80
29 200,000 Guatemala, 1960-96
30 190,000 Laos, 1975-90
31 175,000 Serbia against Croatia, Bosnia-Herzegovina, Kosovo, 1991-1999
32 150,000 Romania, 1949-99 (own people)
33 150,000 Liberia, 1989-97
34 140,000 Russia against Chechnya, 1994-present
35 150,000 Lebanon civil war, 1975-90
36 140,000 Kuwait War, 1990-91
37 130,000 Philippines: 1946-54 (10,000); 1972-present (120,000)
38 130,000 Burma/Myanmar, 1948-present
39 100,000 North Yemen, 1962-70
40 100,000 Sierra Leone, 1991-present
41 100,000 Albania, 1945-91 (own people)
42 80,000 Iran, 1978-79 (revolution)
43 75,000 Iraq, 2003-present (domestic)
44 75,000 El Salvador, 1975-92
45 70,000 Eritrea against Ethiopia, 1998-2000
46 68,000 Sri Lanka, 1997-present
47 60,000 Zimbabwe, 1966-79; 1980-present
48 60,000 Nicaragua, 1972-91 (Marxists/natives etc,)
49 51,000 Arab-Israeli conflict 1950-present
50 50,000 North Vietnam, 1954-75 (own people)
51 50,000 Tajikistan, 1992-96 (secularists against Islamists)
52 50,000 Equatorial Guinea, 1969-79
53 50,000 Peru, 1980-2000
54 50,000 Guinea, 1958-84
55 40,000 Chad, 1982-90
56 30,000 Bulgaria, 1948-89 (own people)
57 30,000 Rhodesia, 1972-79
58 30,000 Argentina, 1976-83 (own people)
59 27,000 Hungary, 1948-89 (own people)
60 26,000 Kashmir independence, 1989-present
61 25,000 Jordan government vs. Palestinians, 1970-71 (Black September)
62 22,000 Poland, 1948-89 (own people)
63 20,000 Syria, 1982 (against Islamists in Hama)
64 20,000 Chinese-Vietnamese war, 1979
65 19,000 Morocco: war against France, 1953-56 (3,000) and in Western Sahara, 1975-present (16,000)
66 18,000 Congo Republic, 1997-99
67 10,000 South Yemen, 1986 (civil war)

*All figures rounded. Sources: Brzezinski, Z., Out of Control: Global Turmoil on the Eve of the Twenty-first Century, 1993; Courtois, S., Le Livre Noir du Communism, 1997; Heinsohn, G., Lexikon der Vöölkermorde, 1999, 2nd ed.; Heinsohn, G., Sööhne und Weltmacht, 2006, 8th ed.; Rummel. R., Death by Government, 1994; Small, M. and Singer, J.D., Resort to Arms: International and Civil Wars 1816-1980, 1982; White, M., "Death Tolls for the Major Wars and Atrocities of the Twentieth Century," 2003.

This grisly inventory finds the total number of deaths in conflicts since 1950 numbering about 85,000,000. Of that sum, the deaths in the Arab-Israeli conflict since 1950 include 32,000 deaths due to Arab state attacks and 19,000 due to Palestinian attacks, or 51,000 in all. Arabs make up roughly 35,000 of these dead and Jewish Israelis make up 16,000.


Note: Opinions expressed in comments are those of the authors alone and not necessarily those of Daniel Pipes. Original writing only, please. Comments are screened for relevance, substance, and tone, and in some cases edited before posting. Reasoned disagreement is welcome, but comments are rejected if scurrilous, off-topic, vulgar, ad hominem, or otherwise viewed as inappropriate. For complete regulations, see the Guidelines for Comments. For informational purposes, we identify countries from which comments are sent.

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Reader comments (63) on this item

Title By Date
A few questions [117 words]Stefan PatejakApr 9, 2008 13:28
Modern Liberalism's Fascist Roots [336 words]orange yonasonJun 11, 2008 13:37
silliness [183 words]mattJan 24, 2008 14:48
matt I was hoping you wouldn't generalize [145 words]SilicondocJan 29, 2008 17:29
Buy the book, for the economy's sake! [265 words]mattJan 29, 2008 19:40
Hmmm, more of the same [1038 words]SilicondocFeb 5, 2008 08:38
This book is amazing [140 words]Henrik R ClausenJan 20, 2008 12:10
Recent events have shown [39 words]Rocky LoreJan 20, 2008 02:37
Karl Rovism with a New Name [44 words]Barry ListJan 17, 2008 11:19
Quote [32 words]ClarkJan 15, 2008 18:21
Semantics and Rhetoric [145 words]Peter HerzJan 15, 2008 17:58
Long a thinking man's suspicion is finally in a book form [92 words]Fiona GradyJan 12, 2008 13:13
Yes indeed [24 words]ClarkJan 15, 2008 18:10
Hitler and Mussolini were not socialists [60 words]PseudoerasmusJan 12, 2008 11:37
The principle of subsidiarity [344 words]Tomas KiersteinJan 14, 2008 14:32
Well said [54 words]ClarkJan 15, 2008 18:15
Comment on Tomas Kierstein [654 words]PseudoerasmusJan 17, 2008 20:36
Economics vs. political [38 words]DeadbambiMar 15, 2008 22:23
Hitler and Mussolini WERE socialists [112 words]LeeFeb 26, 2009 18:27
From Liberal Authoritarianism to Islamo Fascism [590 words]Ann FarmerJan 11, 2008 17:55
The Flying Inn [152 words]Tomas Kierstein (Denmark)Jan 11, 2008 19:36
The Fascism of Liberalism [682 words]Ann FarmerJan 13, 2008 15:23
Jonah Goldberg: Bolshevik Conservative [127 words]Elilhu DavisonJan 11, 2008 07:32
Solid studies on Leftism and Liberalism [194 words]George KeselmanJan 12, 2008 12:29
Dutch translation [950 words]FerdyJan 11, 2008 06:49
Marx Brothers [667 words]Tomas Kierstein (Denmark)Jan 11, 2008 05:00
For some people it was evident long ago [7 words]R.B., IsraelJan 11, 2008 04:00
One of the most Important Articles Ever at danielpipes.org [4 words]YnnatchkahJan 11, 2008 00:56
linkage [8 words]Consul-At-ArmsJan 11, 2008 00:05
An interesting review by a bright young man, whose career I have followed since he was studying in Prague. [315 words]Jascha KesslerJan 10, 2008 23:43
Mussolini, McCarthy and Bush. Born out of fear. [484 words]trans-parereJan 10, 2008 22:34
Liberal/Conservative ??? [277 words]T. JeffersJan 10, 2008 18:15
The origin of the "conservative" label [207 words]RobertJan 11, 2008 13:30
Black is Still the Preferred Color of Fascism-Who is Wearing Black in the Middle East Now? [467 words]M. ToveyJan 10, 2008 17:47
The bright man's burden [63 words]Pat HenryJan 10, 2008 17:26
Limited Government [75 words]Anthony CooperJan 10, 2008 16:04
Fascism's Legacy: Liberatlism [213 words]kim segarJan 10, 2008 15:40
⇒ Fascism and liberalism [703 words]Donald W. BalesJan 10, 2008 15:19
Thank you Mr. Bales, I find that number SMALL. [244 words]SilicondocFeb 5, 2008 09:03
Deaths [45 words]Donald W. BalesFeb 6, 2008 09:22
Socialism [59 words]Donald W. BalesFeb 6, 2008 19:48
Ok, then I've overestimated the percentage [103 words]SilicondocFeb 7, 2008 05:18
Liberalism and Fascism [43 words]Prof. Irving HexhamJan 10, 2008 13:10
We agree -- it's a worn out term [180 words]Eben SpinozaJan 10, 2008 12:51
The lesson of Hannukah [71 words]David W. LincolnJan 10, 2008 11:50
Liberal fascists versus conservatives [196 words]Michael P BiberJan 10, 2008 11:12
CAMPUS WATCH DEFINITION OF MCCARTHYISM [431 words]Mary ConnellyJan 10, 2008 11:00
Distorting Reality [414 words]Steve RalstonJan 10, 2008 10:58
Let freedom ring [338 words]Rebecca MouldsJan 10, 2008 10:24
wrong paper [188 words]cvtJan 10, 2008 09:39
Liberal Fascists [227 words]Dennis MiddlebroksJan 10, 2008 09:17
Communists & fascists:The Totalitarian Tag-Team [230 words]Alan HootnickJan 10, 2008 09:06
Comment on Daniel Pipes article "Fascism's Legacy: Liberalism" [185 words]J.S.Jan 10, 2008 09:00
Oppressive government by any name remains oppressive government. [423 words]reevesJan 10, 2008 08:14
to reader Reeves [124 words]Fred HerreroAug 30, 2008 18:46
At Last A Dose Of Reality [226 words]Seamus MacNemiJan 10, 2008 07:24
Hillary Clinton [76 words]LeonardJan 10, 2008 07:22
My golly, what is hillarycare and 5k per baby ? [437 words]SilicondocFeb 5, 2008 09:22
The Liberal-Fascist Connection [164 words]Prof. Paul EidelbergJan 10, 2008 05:49
Your article 5355: Fascism's Legacy: Liberalism
[w/response] [46 words]
Gabriel NewhouseJan 10, 2008 03:26
Liberals hate seeing themselves as they are, totalitarian fascists [257 words]Ken BesigJan 10, 2008 02:16
Types of fascism [101 words]Janusz KowalikJan 10, 2008 01:46
Liberal Fascism [62 words]Rev. Gary CollierJan 10, 2008 01:36

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Note: Opinions expressed in comments are those of the authors alone and not necessarily those of Daniel Pipes. Original writing only, please. Comments are screened for relevance, substance, and tone, and in some cases edited before posting. Reasoned disagreement is welcome, but comments are rejected if scurrilous, off-topic, vulgar, ad hominem, or otherwise viewed as inappropriate. For complete regulations, see the Guidelines for Comments. For informational purposes, we identify countries from which comments are sent.

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