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Daisy and Orange Yonason

Reader comment on item: White House Nonchalance [toward the Middle East]
in response to reader comment: The Myth of "good Islam". - Truth vs. reallity.

Submitted by Tomas (Denmark), Mar 23, 2006 at 15:50

Dear Daisy, Dear Orange Yonason.

I`m very sorry if I have left anyone with the impression, that I look down on America, believe Europe - or indeed my self as a person - to be superior, or any thing else of that sort.

Daisy, I have only written two comments on Dr. Pipes blog in all. The one in question, and a comment to another article, where I supported Mark`s warning to Islamists, who - foolishly - consider the Western culture to be weak. The one latterly mentioned was rather a gung-ho, undivided support to America. Are you sure, that you do not confuse me for somebody else?

I`m also quite amazed, that you view my critisism on the multicultural experiment as an attack on America. It`s not. I`m not a flagwaving European, in fact I`m a very old-fascioned, national-conservative (Burkean organicism is close to where I stand), Monarchistic (constitutional, that is) Dane, belonging to the Lutheran Danish Church, and frequently being called "Reactionary". The only flag I wave is the Danish Dannebrog, and my thoughts on the European Union are not fit for being printed on a site, which I believe is being screened for profanities.

I`m the chairman of an organization which is blaintantly anti-Islamic, and has had the pleasure of being mentioned - among others - in a book, written by a left-wing super apologist, with the title: "The Front; the new right wing"(title translated word by word from Danish). Some Muslims have refered to me as a "Jew-lover", which I gladly accept to be. Around 7.500 Danes are self-proclaimed Jews, and are generally very deligent professionally, and loyal subjects to our Queen.

My favorite English poem is "Famous Men" by Kipling, and my favorite American ditto is "The road I did not take" by Frost.

I don`t look down on America at all. I believe that we owe our freedom to you, and I support the war in Iraq for that sole reason. I dont believe that democracy can be installed in Iraq, so my support is simply a recoqnition of the debt to America and the UK, that we Danes duely owe, and because the ones seing the buisness-end of the coalition guns are people, whom I primarily view as my enemies.

The reasons why I dont believe Iraq will become democratic are plentyfull enough for more than ten essays, so I`ll just say, that Mr. Pat Buchanan`s views on that subject are very close to mine, or mine to his I`ll better say, so no one deducts any hidden arrogance from my statements. As a Dane I have a disadvantage in this forum, because we are so sarcastic and informal in our way, that it`s often mistaken for insulence or arrogance by others. Our tradition is essentially the same as the ancient norsemen; we can`t help taking the p... out of both others and ourselves all the time, a feature that has obviously angered a lot of Muslims lately, but that`s life!

Multiculturalism is the American reallity, but in Europe it`s a new thing, that has been introduced as a project by the elite, without asking ordinary people if they approved. There`s a huge difference between these two scenarios, and I don`t wish to compete in a game called: "Who`s the cultural achiever then!" I don`t fight my friends! I can disagree, but when in the "trench", I lay down any intellectual relativism and shoot on sight.

What you call integration, I would call assimilation, or integration of virtues. No matter how multicultural America is, your legal and administrative tradition is still essentially English: Your official language is English, your legal system is build on the same tradition of being "judge by ones peers", has the double-jeopardy rule, and so on. If people accept this - essentially English - system, then they can keep there other cultural features.(correct me if I`m wrong) What I`m aiming at is, that multiculturalism can function, but only as a curiosum. The laws, the governing tradition, and the other basic functions on which the society rest, must be quite monolitic. I can recommend the English author Roger Scrutons books on that topic, as well as super American Ronald Reagan`s reflections on Burke, as to the English heritage`s impact on American thinking.
By the way, I loved "Ron and Nancy", even though I`ve always considdered astrology as being fraud and superstition.

When European politicians talk about integration, they - unfortunately - talk about that, which the word really means: To take two or more different things, mix them, after which process a "brave new thing" or -World appears. That`s about the most arrogant idea, that I`ve ever heard of, and completely utopic as well. This is where the Dhimmitude comes in, because they talk about how we can "learn" from each other, which in reallity means that we should learn from Islam, because the true beliver in Islamic doctrines belives these to be perfect, so logically only we can(but we b......won`t) change for this insane fairytale to come true.

What I cannot comprehend is why it`s seen as such a fantastic idea to deliberately and forcefully mix two so different Cultures. What`s the point? Who will benefit? Not the ordinary European for sure, and I very much doubt that it will benefit the average Muslim, who has been drawn to Europe by - as you quite rightly state - our liberal welfare systems. It could very likely become his personal undoing, but I`ll return to that.

States like Denmark, Sweden, Norway, Finland etc., have never been immigration countries. We have no tradition for that. Our social "glue" is not an ideological one, but a historic one, based on the fact that our Peoples are essentially tribes. Multiculturalism will never work in Northern Europe(my cultural area of reference), because we have no tradition for it, and because it will collide with the fact, that the State is the same as our ancestrial home, and not a project. To believe that one is able to change a thousand year long tradition with the reference to "beautiful ideas" is simply naive and extremely dangerous.

"In Rome, do as the Romans", or get out! It`s so very simple. Individual muslims who can accept the secular order of things here, will be able to make a future for themselves. Those who know with themselves, that they want sharia law, should evacuate.

The European leaders are sweet talking and sound weak. The ordinary people on the streets are not, I can assure you. Political correctness makes people shut up in public, but not in private. It`s like a pressure-boiler, where some fool has hammered a nail into the safety valve.

For the time being, the Danish economy is blooming. We have the lowest unemployment rate in recorded history, and a massive surplus on our fiscal (is that spelled so?) budget, so massive that we anticipate to be rid of all public debts within less than a decade. Despite this we are growing grumpier and more and more aggressive towards Islam by the hour. Imagine what will happen if the World economy collapses, and thus drags our economy down as it falls. European history shows how fast our face can change. As long as our bellies are full, and the groups of antagonistic middle eastern "kids" in our City-streets are still merely annoying, we will probably remain the nice seem-to-be-dhimmies.

It`s a fraile balance, and it`ll just take changing a couple of parameters for the average European to loose faith in the protective force of the system. When that happens, and he - rightfully - fears a future where his granddaughter is forced into a Burca, then the scene is set for a Europe you wont believe. No nationbuilding and no Wilsonian idealism will be able to do anything about it. It will tricker man`s most basic mindset; that of survival.

That`s why I spend so much time speaking up against Islams precence in Europe. If I do nothing, and we either submit to Islam over time - which I don`t believe - or wait so long, that the stand down will take place in the streets, I could not live with myself. if had not been speaking my piece, while I had the chance.

Dear Orange Yonason,

Oh, I`m a very proud Dane. The reason I don`t see the freedom of speech as universal is merely because it`s not universally recoqnized. To believe it to be universal may lead one to let one's guard down, when ever some smooth-talking Muslim tries to assure us, that they recoqnize that freedom too. Our ability to speek is a natural feature, that only humans have, but the right to use it freely is an aquired right, that has been aquired by force, and can only be maintained by force. Peace is a dream for the idealistic of mind. I don`t have one idealistic bone in my body, and I believe that cease-fire is a more proper word for what can be sustained. "Never mind that they hate, as long as they fear!" In my view rights are rights if they can backed upby force. Ask any battered wife about that.

Dhimmitude rhetoric is dangerous, because it could very well make the Islamically minded people (I`ve been a good boy, and left a door open for the secular Muslim - not that I believe he exists, but the benefit of the doubt...I`m such a Teddybear, hi, hi). I would hate to have to do dreadful deeds to survive, and thus I will try to make a difference while words are the "guns", if not for anything else, then for my own peace of mind.

If, however, the situation deteriorates to the point I mentioned above, then my Teddy-bear-days are over. Fate has put me in couple of tight spots in the past, and I have no illusions left as to what I`m capable of, if I feel seriously threatened. The Tomas who`s guided only by his hidden, reptilian instincts is not a nice guy, and I`ll rather prefer if I can keep him locked up. I`m big enough a cynic to suspect that the nice farmer, that lives ½ mile from where I sit now, can transform in the same way.

So, dear Orange Yonason, I`m probably what you would call a redneck, when it comes to pride and defending my loved-ones: Family, friends, other Danes and allies, in that order.

Please bear with my occasional flawed spelling, I`m a welder by trade, and have tought myself English.

Best regards

Tomas
Submitting....

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