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A horrible persecution coming

Reader comment on item: There's a Name for Trump's Brand of Politics: Neo-fascism
in response to reader comment: American Administration Vacillation Between Turkey and Russia Against Israel

Submitted by Michael S (United States), Jul 9, 2016 at 04:46

Hi, Tovey. You said,

"Definitions of true Zionism and the difficulty of some in identifying the perpetrators (the sons of Ismael and the like) that desire to wrest away the promise from the sons of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob) are central to the issues being contested today."

I agree. You went on,

"The American Administrative Chief Executive has done and continues to do untold damage in an inexorable attempt to redefine a world..."

I agree. You went on,


"As for Erdoǧan, his continuing ambition of a recovered Ottoman regime still smolders in his imagination and wherever and whenever he can, he makes a deal..."

That seems to jibe with reality. You went on,

"...Russia and Turkey in prepping for the conclusion of the Ezekiel scenario, the scriptural reference of bring the enemies of Israel out of the 'far north' precludes Turkey, for out of the far north are the children of Israel reclaimed; and therein is the geography defined. In either definition, however, the trigger is not that they initiate the invasion of Israel themselves, but they are primary respondents in the case the LORD has against all nations for the treatment of Israel; yet they are called to lead a charge: (Ezekiel 38:16)."

Your position is reasonable, though I tend to be more stringent -- which reminds me that to most of the world, you and I probably seem like frum Jews discussing poksim. The scriptures speak of the "Far North", which could mean Russia or Turkey; but the rest of the passage refers overwhelmingly to Turkey. This is the country I focus on, when interpreting today's events. You went on,

" the true believer who sets his heart towards Zion is called to obedience to His pleasure."

We're close, on that one. By a "true believer", I think of one who entrusts his life to YHVH very deeply. I think I'm in that category. What it means to me, is that I have read the entire Bible, over and over many times, because I trust that the truth of reality is embedded in there. In reading the scriptures, of course, it's hard to miss the centrality of Israel and the Jewish people to God's designs. That doesn't mean that I am Jewish, nor even want to become Jewish; because the Bible also shows me how non-Jewish people, such as Noah, Job and Cornelius were able to win favor with God. Even so, I can't conceive of someone being against God's plan for Israel while at the same time seeking God's favor toward one's self. You went on,

"Not even the faltering designs of the vacillating American Administrative regime can change the foolishness that the western powers have cloaked themselves in, for the suction of the vortex they themselves have caused will pull them in as well:(Joel 3:9). Therefore: (Zephaniah 3:8)."

Of course, I will look up your "Therefore..."

Zephaniah 3:
[1] Woe to her that is filthy and polluted, to the oppressing city!
[2] She obeyed not the voice; she received not correction; she trusted not in the LORD; she drew not near to her God.
[3] Her princes within her are roaring lions; her judges are evening wolves; they gnaw not the bones till the morrow.
[4] Her prophets are light and treacherous persons: her priests have polluted the sanctuary, they have done violence to the law.
[5] The just LORD is in the midst thereof; he will not do iniquity: every morning doth he bring his judgment to light, he faileth not; but the unjust knoweth no shame.
[6] I have cut off the nations: their towers are desolate; I made their streets waste, that none passeth by: their cities are destroyed, so that there is no man, that there is none inhabitant.
[7] I said, Surely thou wilt fear me, thou wilt receive instruction; so their dwelling should not be cut off, howsoever I punished them: but they rose early, and corrupted all their doings.
[8] Therefore wait ye upon me, saith the LORD, until the day that I rise up to the prey: for my determination is to gather the nations, that I may assemble the kingdoms, to pour upon them mine indignation, even all my fierce anger: for all the earth shall be devoured with the fire of my jealousy.
[9] For then will I turn to the people a pure language, that they may all call upon the name of the LORD, to serve him with one consent.
[10] From beyond the rivers of Ethiopia my suppliants, even the daughter of my dispersed, shall bring mine offering.

That sounds like the events of Zechariah 14. I expect that to happen AFTER Ezekiel 38-39, after:

Ezekiel 39:
[11] And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will give unto Gog a place there of graves in Israel, the valley of the passengers on the east of the sea: and it shall stop the noses of the passengers: and there shall they bury Gog and all his multitude: and they shall call it The valley of Hamon-gog.
[12] And seven months shall the house of Israel be burying of them, that they may cleanse the land.
[13] Yea, all the people of the land shall bury them; and it shall be to them a renown the day that I shall be glorified, saith the Lord GOD.
[14] And they shall sever out men of continual employment, passing through the land to bury with the passengers those that remain upon the face of the earth, to cleanse it: after the end of seven months shall they search.
[15] And the passengers that pass through the land, when any seeth a man's bone, then shall he set up a sign by it, till the buriers have buried it in the valley of Hamon-gog.
[16] And also the name of the city shall be Hamonah. Thus shall they cleanse the land.


...and after Israel uses Turkey's weapons for fuel for seven years. That may include fuel from their nuclear reactors; and Iran's:

Ezekiel 39:
[9] And they that dwell in the cities of Israel shall go forth, and shall set on fire and burn the weapons, both the shields and the bucklers, the bows and the arrows, and the handstaves, and the spears, and they shall burn them with fire seven years:
[10] So that they shall take no wood out of the field, neither cut down any out of the forests; for they shall burn the weapons with fire: and they shall spoil those that spoiled them, and rob those that robbed them, saith the Lord GOD.

It's only after these things happen, that I expect Messiah to return. After then, there will be no more burying of the dead; and the world's weapons will be converted to agricultural implements:

Isaiah 2:
[2] And it shall come to pass in the last days, that the mountain of the LORD's house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it.
[3] And many people shall go and say, Come ye, and let us go up to the mountain of the LORD, to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths: for out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the LORD from Jerusalem.
[4] And he shall judge among the nations, and shall rebuke many people: and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more.

If it weren't for the seven years prophesied in Ezekiel 39, I would be expecting Obama and NATO to turn on a dime to attack Israel, over any pretext; and the French would be willing accomplices; but the Bible says Turkey must attack first, in alliance with Iran. That could happen under President H. Clinton, or under President Trump; or it could happen under the leader to be elected after him or her, in 2020 or 2024. Halfway through the seven years, I expect a horrible persecution of the church.


Note: Opinions expressed in comments are those of the authors alone and not necessarily those of Daniel Pipes. Original writing only, please. Comments are screened and in some cases edited before posting. Reasoned disagreement is welcome but not comments that are scurrilous, off-topic, commercial, disparaging religions, or otherwise inappropriate. For complete regulations, see the "Guidelines for Reader Comments".

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Note: Opinions expressed in comments are those of the authors alone and not necessarily those of Daniel Pipes. Original writing only, please. Comments are screened and in some cases edited before posting. Reasoned disagreement is welcome but not comments that are scurrilous, off-topic, commercial, disparaging religions, or otherwise inappropriate. For complete regulations, see the "Guidelines for Reader Comments".

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