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Unconstructive comments in reply to young muslim!!
Reader comment on item: Militant Islam's New Strongholds

Submitted by Trevor Stanley (Australia), Mar 15, 2003 at 17:11

I was just reading some of the comments in response to the "Young American Muslim Adolescent".

The muslim world is currently facing a crisis in parallel with the crisis faced by the west. The west's crisis is that a disciplined, ruthless, multinational terrorist organisation, which has spent the past decade infiltrating networks into our communities, is trying to kill us, and there is very little we can do about it which will bring immediate results. Many people are trying to find easy ways out.

Many on the left say that if we only stop doing all the terrible things we've supposedly been doing, or perhaps redistribute the world's wealth, everything will be ok again. In Australia, leftists have claimed that the Bali bombings were retribution for Australia's alliance with America against Iraq. These commentators have made no attempt to explain why a French tanker was bombed by al Qaeda, or why the 11th September agents were not impoverished by the west, but on the contrary enriched by it. On the other hand, many in the west seem to think that concluding that Islam itself is the enemy, is the answer. I must say I have at times been surprised at the number of muslim 'intellectuals' who have followed the same pattern of the western left-intellectuals - they have denounced the terrorist attacks in a short paragraph then spent the rest of their article or sermon railing against the west. However, I have a number of muslim friends and acquaintances whom I know are shocked by the actions of al Qaeda, and ashamed that these actions are being associated with their religion. None of them has in any way indicated that they thought the US 'had it coming'.

This brings me to the crisis for muslims. Unbeknownst to many in the west, the muslim world is engaged in a protracted struggle between moderates and radical islamists. As the islamists are religious fanatics, they tend to 'punch above their weight'. The moderates are like you and me - they vote the way they believe, but most are not actively involved in politics. The radicals, on the other hand, believe that they must struggle relentlessly for sharia law, that every moment of idleness is a sin against Allah. Is it any wonder that their voices are heard more often than those of the moderates? For most people in the muslim world, this is like being a German in 1935. There's this crowd of belligerant fanatics committing the most atrocious acts in your name - and there is nothing much you can do about it. Keep in mind that the militant islamists often attack their fellow muslims for being 'apostates' (ie straying from the path). This is a very old battle which we in the west have only just woken up to, despite the fact that Osama bin Laden has been trying to pick a fight with us since 1991. Most Australians are still unaware that in the weeks before and after the Bali bombings, there was also a string of about a dozen terrorist bombings in the Philippines.

Essentially, this division in the muslim world is a huge advantage for us in the west. Great news: we are not alone against a billion muslims. In fact, we are helping the muslim world to clean up its extremists. So where are all the moderate muslims? They do exist. In fact, Salih bin Muhammad al-Luheidan, Chairman of the Supreme Judicial Council of Saudi Arabia, issued a sharia ruling on the 14th of September 2001 in which he unequivocally condemned the 11th September attacks. An excerpt: "Viewing what happened to the Twin Towers was like watching Doomsday. Those who commit such crimes are the worst of people. Anyone who thinks that any Islamic scholar will condone such acts is totally wrong. Aggression, injustice and gloating over the kind of crime that we have seen are totally unacceptable and forbidden in Islam." I have other examples, but do not have time to find them and type them in at present. Many of them are directed at the muslim community, where they will do the most good. You should also remember that unlike, say, the Catholic Church, the Muslim faith does not have a single, universally recognised hierarchy. There are quite a number of maverick 'religious scholars' out there who are about as representative of Islam as the guy standing on the corner shouting "The world will end on tuesday unless you embrace Christ" is of Christianity.

The media also plays a role here. The headline "Sheikh declares US Satan Reaping Wrath of Allah" sells a lot more papers than "Recognised Saudi scholars reiterate that killing civilians is wrong". It doesn't matter whether the papers point out that various councils of islamic law have declared that the Nutty Sheikh has no actual standing or authority to make such claims, because that qualification doesn't really register in the same way as the 'seas of blood' rhetoric does. Keep in mind that in Indonesia, which is often touted as "The biggest muslim country in the world", Sharia-Islamist parties struggle to retain 4% of the vote. Most of the unrest in that country is the product of the tension between moderates and militants described above.

The last thing I want to comment on is the claim that Islam is a violent religion. Yes, people like the Ayatollah Khomeini said that the Koran commands muslims to be violent. In much the same way, the Grand Dragon of the Ku Klux Klan says the Bible commands us to incinerate people who are 'the wrong colour' - most unchristian! On the other hand, the standard muslim greeting, Salaam Aleikum, means "peace be upon you". And in case you hadn't noticed, the Iranian Republic is not too popular with its people these days! The argument about whether the Koran tells people to be violent has been played out time and again, pointlessly. I just opened up the King James Bible. The first thing I saw was "The punishments upon disobedience", in Deuteronomy 28 - my eyes came to rest on the words "Cursed shalt thou be when thou comest in, and cursed shalt thou be when thou goest out. The Lord shall send upon thee cursing, vexation, and rebuke, on all that thou settest thine hand unto for to do, until thou be destroyed, and until thou perish quickly; because of the wickedness of thy doings, whereby thou hast forsaken me." (It continues in this way for another three pages). What a charming fellow the Lord is, eh? Hmm... on that topic, "the law of blasphemy" is listed under Leviticus 24. It involves "the son of an Israelitish woman, whose father was an Egyptian", so the naive reader could conclude that this passage is directed at jews and/or modern-day Egyptians. "And The Lord spake unto Moses, saying, Bring forth him that hath cursed without the camp, and let all that heard him lay their hands upon his head, and let all the congregation stone him. [...] And he that blasphemeth the name of the LORD, he shall surely be put to death, and all the congregation shall certainly stone him [...] And he that killeth any man shall surely be put to death [...mandatory capital punishment for manslaughter? ...] And Moses spake to the children of Israel, that they should bring forth him that had cursed out of the camp, and stone him with stones. And the children of Israel did as the LORD commanded Moses."

So there we have it. A spot of Christian sharia law, straight from the Old Testament, which Christianity inherited from the Jews. I'm glad I'm typing this over the internet, rather than saying it face-to-face, because I'd have been stoned halfway through the previous paragraph, right?

Any book of divine writing, be it the Bible, the Koran, or whatever, can be read a number of different ways. If you want to read it as a justification for acts which can only be reasonably construed as evil, you can do that with any such book. If you are a decent person, you can find ample inspiration for moral development from the same book. How do you expect a moderate muslim to describe the Koran? "Oh, well, yes, it does have some bits about stoning people, but most muslims ignore those bits"...? The only reasonable alternatives are (a) state that the Koran is a book of peace (which for moderate muslims it is), or (b) renounce one's faith.

Grabbing a copy of the Koran and rifling through it for juicy jihad bits will not help you understand Islam!

If you're not sure how to bolster moderate muslims, I think it's fair to say that telling someone that they are wrong to believe their religion is peaceful, and that you think it should be 'straightened out' by the application of external force is probably not the way to go about it.

I'm not just saying this to be argumentative. I really do want this problem sorted out in the shortest time possible (which is probably at least 20 years) because I don't like people being blown to bits, especially when those people could include me and my loved ones! The only way we can do this is if moderate muslims and the west work together against militant islamists, rather than playing into Osama's hands by denying moderates the opportunity to work with us.

Yes, there are major barriers between muslim and non-muslim cultures. It will take a lot of time for mutual understanding to develop. I've certainly done a lot of reading, discussing and thinking over the past two years. I think it's worth the effort though.

Trevor Stanley.
Perspectives on World History and Current Events.
http://geocities.com/pwhce/
[The quotes from the Saudi Supreme Judicial Council Chairman come from Rubin and Rubin, "Anti-American Terrorism and the Middle East: A Documentary Reader", page 305. That section, "Middle East Reaction to September 11", contains unqualified condemnation of the terrorists from pages 301-315. Some of it is highly critical of many in the muslim world. It's definitely worth a read.]

Note: Opinions expressed in comments are those of the authors alone and not necessarily those of Daniel Pipes. Original writing only, please. Comments are screened for relevance, substance, and tone, and in some cases edited before posting. Reasoned disagreement is welcome, but comments are rejected if scurrilous, off-topic, vulgar, ad hominem, or otherwise viewed as inappropriate. For complete regulations, see the Guidelines for Comments. For informational purposes, we identify countries from which comments are sent.

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Title By Date
is islam spread via the sword ? [170 words]Phil GreendMay 31, 2007 21:21
Kind and Violent Islam [92 words]Hassan AlaviJul 31, 2007 07:08
please read well [189 words]haniOct 9, 2007 08:12
A dramatic presentation of Daniel's point [311 words]David PaulSep 21, 2006 10:24
The pain of Hindu Bengalis [210 words]PBDec 24, 2005 05:36
Understanding [200 words]CovertOct 11, 2005 00:41
GET OVER IT! [150 words]I want to remain secretSep 26, 2005 03:00
Re: Sukanta Nag and Islam [169 words]A TAug 9, 2005 17:23
Islam is being attacked for containing the truth [291 words]M.N HimedMay 18, 2005 20:26
Response to commenter Mr. Bebek Das [168 words]Sukanta NagFeb 9, 2005 14:34
Bomb the Nuclear sites in Iran - Bomb the Heck out of Iraq - So that our soldiers can come home!! [223 words]Michael McKenzieDec 16, 2004 10:11
What strongholds? [67 words]OMAR THE LITERATENov 17, 2004 04:25
Kudos [323 words]JHRanger33Jul 21, 2004 16:17
Quotes relating historical incidents. [179 words]ShahJun 29, 2004 23:55
The Current situation involving Muslims [142 words]Robbie J.Apr 16, 2004 13:11
bangladeshi hindu independence [81 words]s pFeb 8, 2004 09:17
Dealing with the root of the problem:Saudi Arabia [244 words]Nov 30, 2003 08:21
MILTANT ISLAM HAS EXISTED SINCE THE TIME OF MOHAMMED. STOP MAKING EXCUSES FOR THE EVIL IT PERPETRATES. [212 words]UNOWENNov 20, 2003 18:07
Islamophobia - the New Apologists for Islam [324 words]Paul ClarkNov 15, 2003 03:39
is it ok britain invaded other countes for a 1000 years? [23 words]IsmailNov 16, 2006 14:38
I could not agree more [77 words]mikeNov 4, 2003 19:24
Bangladesh -- response to M Rashid [167 words]Sumana ChakmaNov 3, 2003 06:49
Mr. Pipes: Milistant Islam spreads in Latin America [457 words]Reneli in UtahSep 3, 2003 11:34
Some points to ponder regarding Islam [1077 words]Bhumi PutraApr 23, 2008 17:14
Political Correctness [68 words]Bhumi PutraMay 4, 2008 16:04
Some sources regarding "Some Points to Ponder..." [820 words]Bhumi PutraMay 6, 2008 15:35
We are NOT the creators of Al-Quaida and WOE be to us if we try to give some of Israel to Palestine! [45 words]KathreenMay 22, 2003 22:01
MILITANT ISLAM'S NEW STRONGHOLD [201 words]C.VazquezMay 17, 2003 10:46
The last remaining Colonialists [101 words]alfred sporerMay 6, 2003 21:02
eminent domain? [151 words]Paul WilliamApr 3, 2003 21:08
Bangladesh Eye-Opener [75 words]Kaafir SinghApr 1, 2003 03:06
I think your very WRONG MR.KAAFIR SINGH [148 words]ikra rahmanOct 28, 2006 18:01
⇒ Unconstructive comments in reply to young muslim!! [1669 words]Trevor StanleyMar 15, 2003 17:11
Bangladesh [79 words]M RashidMar 4, 2003 12:46
Thank God for Daniel Pipes [103 words]William SmithJan 28, 2003 19:05
Militant Islam is not Islam [263 words]Gabriel GrossoJan 3, 2003 16:31
Pakistan is the source; Saudi is just the Banker [244 words]Andrei LeonidovichDec 29, 2002 10:42
Islamic Time Line Of Violent Events [176 words]SteveDec 13, 2002 16:05
Hate and terror as a religious principle [214 words]A.J. RedlhammerDec 9, 2002 12:15
Response to Tom Pensyl's comments: So disturbingly accurate [96 words]Mike, EuropeDec 4, 2002 14:22
Militant Islam is Everywhere! [175 words]Greg OfieshNov 13, 2002 16:12
What will be America's foreign policy on Middle East when there is no need for oil? [108 words]Mariappan EddiahNov 11, 2002 03:39
Response to young 'American' Muslim [95 words]J.ShearerNov 4, 2002 08:18
To commenter Young American Muslim adolescent [36 words]John Gould, Jr.Oct 31, 2002 22:18
What the hell are we doing? [243 words]ShuvaMar 15, 2006 23:49
Quran References for commenter Adolescent Muslim [60 words]A. AhmedOct 31, 2002 14:10
Response to A young American Muslim [90 words]Bob PolluchiOct 30, 2002 20:11
We need more Daniel Pipes in this country [173 words]Bob in IllinoisOct 29, 2002 14:03
Coming from a young American Muslim adolescent... [405 words]Rashad R AhmadOct 29, 2002 02:01
Deal with Saudi Arabia [143 words]Tom PensylOct 28, 2002 12:52
You are a true hero. [59 words]R. FranciniOct 26, 2002 23:58
Bigotry [75 words]Lynda ChristianOct 26, 2002 22:30
Why haven't we heard from the "moderates?" [22 words]Dr. T.S. BrittonOct 25, 2002 14:59
Keep on gettng the message out! [86 words]Barb GardeyOct 24, 2002 18:36
Body politic needs surgery [51 words]MarkOct 24, 2002 16:58
Utterly Disgusted [215 words]K AhmedOct 24, 2002 13:28
Daniel in the Lion's Den [29 words]J.ShearerOct 24, 2002 06:59
Muslim immigrants are a grave threat to the West [393 words]Anup ChakmaOct 24, 2002 03:35
Thank you Mr. Pipes [22 words]Larry in AZOct 23, 2002 22:33
The difference between... [228 words]Erek WitheeOct 23, 2002 18:45
The World Must Wake Up to the Dangers [245 words]totalgracerOct 23, 2002 18:31
A Bengladeshi Hindu's "few comments" [1027 words]Bibek DasOct 23, 2002 17:01
For 1400 years, Islam's goal has not changed [61 words]SidOct 23, 2002 15:29
Let's deal with Islam [737 words]Tom PensylOct 23, 2002 14:35
Where are the moderate Muslim leaders? [374 words]Tom McCarthyOct 23, 2002 13:00
Imagine 100 million Muslims living in the U.S. [231 words]N.A.Oct 23, 2002 12:31
Are there two kinds of Islam--Militant and non-Militant?
[w/response] [23 words]
Dr. Durjoy ChowdhuryOct 23, 2002 11:58
What are two kinds of Muslims? [7 words]Mumana AhmedJan 13, 2008 10:23
Thank You Daniel Pipes [19 words]DanOct 23, 2002 10:08
Great article- There really is an evil growing in this country....... [18 words]YacovOct 23, 2002 07:50
What is the difference? [122 words]NTropyOct 23, 2002 04:56
Comment on Quranic Verses [102 words]N. K.Oct 23, 2002 00:51
Tackling Al-Qaeda Easily? [202 words]Hari IyerOct 22, 2002 20:53
Tackling Islamists [94 words]Hari IyerOct 22, 2002 20:45
Comment on Militant Islam's New...
[w/response] [125 words]
Fred W. OserOct 22, 2002 19:10
Thank You [103 words]Joyce WittOct 22, 2002 16:11
War is against militant Islam, not Islam itself [186 words]Steve SingletonOct 22, 2002 15:12
Global Jihad [25 words]Allan KayOct 22, 2002 13:21
You are reading my mind! [276 words]GaryOct 22, 2002 13:14
Excellent article! [142 words]LisaOct 22, 2002 13:08
Thank you. [34 words]Muazzam GillOct 22, 2002 13:01
Separation of Church and State. [83 words]Allen E. WiesenOct 22, 2002 12:07
Not to sound like a bigot... [197 words]H.G.Oct 22, 2002 11:17
Banning Conversions? [13 words]Suave RicoOct 22, 2002 11:03
Imperial Islam [210 words]Arlinda M. DeAngelisOct 22, 2002 09:57
Desperately needs some mainstream attention [42 words]Athena 1040Oct 22, 2002 09:51
The way to deal with Militant Islam [266 words]Haim BelisowskiOct 22, 2002 09:43
Islam not peaceful [14 words]Charles K L JordanOct 22, 2002 08:41

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Note: Opinions expressed in comments are those of the authors alone and not necessarily those of Daniel Pipes. Original writing only, please. Comments are screened for relevance, substance, and tone, and in some cases edited before posting. Reasoned disagreement is welcome, but comments are rejected if scurrilous, off-topic, vulgar, ad hominem, or otherwise viewed as inappropriate. For complete regulations, see the Guidelines for Comments. For informational purposes, we identify countries from which comments are sent.

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