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Tovey: China, Persia and Very Early Islam

Reader comment on item: Islam's Surprising Impact on Daily Life
in response to reader comment: DNM - What is Evidence That Arabs, Not Persian/Asian Influences Referenced Sinim/China

Submitted by dhimmi no more (United States), Dec 16, 2021 at 08:05

Very good questions. The Qur'an is silent about China and even about any place beyond Sothern Palestine and Mesopotamia. The Qur'an tells us that the God of Islam swears by the olives and figs (remember that there is no olives or figs in Mecca back then and now). Allah also swears by Mount Sinai, and He reminds Muhammad that he walks day and night from the location of Sodom and Gomorrah. And Muhammad's tribe is called Quraish (compare with Qirsh or Shark) and I'm you will agree that Sharks would be in the Red Sea and not in arid Mecca. Notice that the Islamic historical tradition tells us about followers of Muhammad that migrated to Ethiopia. However, the tradition is silent about the African city of Adulis.

Yes, I do believe that there was a founder of Islam who lived not in Mecca or Medina but way up north in either Southern Palestine or Mesopotamia (notice that there are reports in the Islamic Historical Tradition that Muhammad belonged to the Quranic sect called al-Sabi'uun who lived in Southern Mesopotamia and spoke a dialect of Aramaic and they are mentioned in the Qur'an

Was Muhammad of founder of Islam? May be! However, I also believe that the founder was a war lord that started the spark for what to become Islam.

Who is the author of the Qur'an? The Qur'an has multiple authors. How do we know? Check Q2:40 and Q2:47. This is an example of what al-Mufasereen called: al-Kalam al-Mukarrar or Allah was in the habit of repeating himself ad-nauseum. Wansbrough called it "Variant Traditions" which really means that the Quranic text must have multiple authors. Remember, nothing drops from the sky and there are no angels with 600 wings (Gabriel is supposed to have 600 wings! go figure) and in other traditions Gabriel appears as a very handsome young man and that Muhammad would spend the night with him! No, I'm not kidding.

How about Asians and the Ahadith literature? Yes, there are very racist Ahadith about the al-Turk (read this as the Turks) and these Ahadith make fun of their broad and flat noses and faces and of their skin color. Very racist nonsense. However, these Ahadith are very much anachronistic

You might be interested in checking the Chinese literary sources with interest in early Islam and you will find them in Hoyland Survey available at amazon

I will stop here and repeat when it comes to Islam and its history there are no simple answers.

Submitting....

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Reader comments (28) on this item

Title Commenter Date Thread
Islam [3 words]Nawacita PostMar 2, 2022 02:28279178
Islam's Crushing Embrace of Education [586 words]RenoxDec 11, 2021 23:02277229
1Our dear Renox صلى الله عليه وسلم : Why do you like to embarrass yourself? [456 words]dhimmi no moreDec 12, 2021 14:40277229
Guiding the Perplexed, Our dear Renox صلى الله عليه وسلم and the word علم from no other than لسان العرب [27 words]dhimmi no moreDec 12, 2021 15:07277229
2Questioning Islamic Originality - What the Invaders Took in Conquest Against Truth [119 words]M ToveyDec 12, 2021 15:28277229
Our dear Renox صلى الله عليه وسلم One More Question Before We Move On [94 words]dhimmi no moreDec 12, 2021 17:01277229
Our dear Renox صلى الله عليه وسلم and very brief introduction to Hunein Ibn Ishaq [330 words]dhimmi no moreDec 13, 2021 07:43277229
2Islamic Sciences and our dear Renox [268 words]dhimmi no moreDec 13, 2021 08:03277229
1Tovey: Our dear Renox is doing his little Da'wa or is it the Pakistani/Indian Tabligh? [323 words]dhimmi no moreDec 13, 2021 08:52277229
2Is DNM omniscient? [111 words]PrashantDec 13, 2021 13:39277229
1Teaching our dear Renox: Very Brief Introduction to the Arabic/Islamic Civilization. [635 words]dhimmi no moreDec 14, 2021 07:40277229
2Our dear Renox صلى الله عليه وسلم and Cherry Picking Time! And who really built the pyramids as per Muslim Historians? [608 words]dhimmi no moreDec 15, 2021 16:46277229
DNM - What is Evidence That Arabs, Not Persian/Asian Influences Referenced Sinim/China [90 words]M ToveyDec 15, 2021 17:44277229
1Tovey: China, Persia and Very Early Islam [418 words]dhimmi no moreDec 16, 2021 08:05277229
Our dear Renox صلى الله عليه وسلم and Refuting the Fable of "Pharaoh the Pharaoh" and His Wife that never existed. [331 words]dhimmi no moreDec 16, 2021 10:58277229
1Our dear Renox and Critical Thinking in Education in Islamic countries! Mashallah! [108 words]dhimmi no moreDec 16, 2021 16:30277229
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Sublimination of a 20 Year Old Question - Is the Conspiracy of the Hidden Hand Still Operational? [187 words]M ToveyDec 28, 2021 13:18277229
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