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Tovey: China, Persia and Very Early Islam

Reader comment on item: Islam's Surprising Impact on Daily Life
in response to reader comment: DNM - What is Evidence That Arabs, Not Persian/Asian Influences Referenced Sinim/China

Submitted by dhimmi no more (United States), Dec 16, 2021 at 08:05

Very good questions. The Qur'an is silent about China and even about any place beyond Sothern Palestine and Mesopotamia. The Qur'an tells us that the God of Islam swears by the olives and figs (remember that there is no olives or figs in Mecca back then and now). Allah also swears by Mount Sinai, and He reminds Muhammad that he walks day and night from the location of Sodom and Gomorrah. And Muhammad's tribe is called Quraish (compare with Qirsh or Shark) and I'm you will agree that Sharks would be in the Red Sea and not in arid Mecca. Notice that the Islamic historical tradition tells us about followers of Muhammad that migrated to Ethiopia. However, the tradition is silent about the African city of Adulis.

Yes, I do believe that there was a founder of Islam who lived not in Mecca or Medina but way up north in either Southern Palestine or Mesopotamia (notice that there are reports in the Islamic Historical Tradition that Muhammad belonged to the Quranic sect called al-Sabi'uun who lived in Southern Mesopotamia and spoke a dialect of Aramaic and they are mentioned in the Qur'an

Was Muhammad of founder of Islam? May be! However, I also believe that the founder was a war lord that started the spark for what to become Islam.

Who is the author of the Qur'an? The Qur'an has multiple authors. How do we know? Check Q2:40 and Q2:47. This is an example of what al-Mufasereen called: al-Kalam al-Mukarrar or Allah was in the habit of repeating himself ad-nauseum. Wansbrough called it "Variant Traditions" which really means that the Quranic text must have multiple authors. Remember, nothing drops from the sky and there are no angels with 600 wings (Gabriel is supposed to have 600 wings! go figure) and in other traditions Gabriel appears as a very handsome young man and that Muhammad would spend the night with him! No, I'm not kidding.

How about Asians and the Ahadith literature? Yes, there are very racist Ahadith about the al-Turk (read this as the Turks) and these Ahadith make fun of their broad and flat noses and faces and of their skin color. Very racist nonsense. However, these Ahadith are very much anachronistic

You might be interested in checking the Chinese literary sources with interest in early Islam and you will find them in Hoyland Survey available at amazon

I will stop here and repeat when it comes to Islam and its history there are no simple answers.

Submitting....

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