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Jalal ad-Din Rumi on Turks

Reader comment on item: Turkey's Last Free Election
in response to reader comment: Armenian Genocide does not exist

Submitted by Ianus (Poland), Jul 6, 2011 at 14:44

sephardi wrote :

> For many centuries you were told the Turks are barbarian, animal because governments did not want to lose their power...Your governments knew very well that where ever Turks go brings human rights, wealth,justice, peace, and modern civilization.<

For a while let's leave in peace governments, even the Turkish government which for its notoriety occupies such a special place among them, and concentrate on a person who has for centuries been in such a high esteem and veneration in Turkey that today every tourist, beside being routinely sermoned on the sanctity and infallibility of Ataturk, is introduced as a matter of course to the wisdom and glory of the founder of the whirling dervishes Jalal ed-Din Rumi (1207-1273), whether on visiting a public Mewalwi performance in a dervish monastery near the gates of Galata in Constantinople or his tomb in Konya - a revered place of pilgrimages and both a source of great pride and income for the city.

True, in 1925 Kemal banned the dervish orders (tekke) and their performances but like so many of his ideas by the 1950-ies the anti-tekke laws fell into disuse and are now as firmly located the dustbin of Turkish history as Ataturk's daydreams of Turkey without Islam. On the contrary, Turkey warmly welcomed the Egyptian and Afghani request that UNESCO should celebrate the 800th birthday of Jalal ad-din Rumi which it zealously did. Turkey herself celebrated Rumi's birthday on 30.09.2007 under the auspices of the Turkish government with a dazzling performance of 300 whirling dervishes (the biggest performance in the almost 800 year-old history of the tekke) broadcasting it live to 8 countries.

In September 2007 UNESO issued a special commemortive medal in honour of Jalal ad-Din Rumi assuring the public i.al. that he is "one of the greatest comprehensive thinkers and scholars of Islamic civilization" and " one of the great humanists, philosophers and poets who belong to humanity in its entirety" whose "works, thoughts and teachings bear supreme witness, in a manner transcending all national, cultural and civilizational boundaries, to the sweet mysteries of divine truth" and whose "very broad appeal, highly advanced thinking, humanism and open heart and mind may derive from his genuinely cosmopolitan character, as during his lifetime he enjoyed exceptionally good relations with people of diverse social, cultural and religious backgrounds. Mawlana was familiar with the core message of all of them and therefore was appreciated by believers of many religions" . At last we are told that his " world ...is not exclusive, but is rather the highest state of a human being – namely, a fully evolved human. He offends no one and includes everyone, as a perfect human being who is in search of love, truth and the unity of the human soul."

Of special importance is UNESCO's hopethat "this medal will prove an encouragement to those who are engaged in a deep and scholarly dissemination of his ideas and ideals, which in turn would in fact enhance the diffusion of the ideals of UNESCO."

Let's not fail UNESCO's hope and, without aspiring to either the depth reached by the UNESCO officials and writers or to directly promoting its lofty agenda, let's disseminate some of the opinions of "the greatest comprehensive thinkers and scholars of Islamic civilization on Turks by whom he is so venerated. In his biography "Manaqib al-Arefin" or "The Acts of teh Adepts" Shams ad-din Ahmad Aflaki says the following : [ Chams ad-Din Aflaki , "Les saints des derviches tourneurs. Récits traduits du persan et annotés par Cl. Huart, Paris 1922, t.2, p.208-209]

"579. A well-known story is told that one day Sheikh Salah ad-Din hired some Turkish workers to construct a stone wall around his garden. "Efendi (My lord ) Salah ad-Din –said the master Jalal ad–Din – for this construction one needs Greek workers. On the contrary if you wanted to demolish it you should hire Turks since constructing the world is the special domain of the Greeks while destroying this very world is the prerogative of the Turks.When God created the world , he at the very beginning created the heedless infidels and gave them a long life and abundant force so that like hired workers they should do their best to unknowingly construct the down-to-earth world. They founded numerous cities, castles on tops of the mountains , settlements on hill tops in a way that these constructions after all the bygone centuries serve as models for people of later times. Yet the Divine Providence has arranged things so that these constructions step by step come into a state of disrepair. Therefore God created the Turkish people to destroy without any mercy and respect all the constructions they saw. This they have done, this they are still doing and this they will be doing it on a daily basis until the Resurrection Day. Eventually the destruction of the city of Konya will take place through the hands of the unjust and ruthless Turks."

[ 579. C'est une histoire bien connue qu'un jour le chéïkh Çalàh-ed-din, pour bâtir les murs de son jardin, avait loué à gages des ouvriers turcs. « Efendi (c'est-à-dire Seigneur) Çalàh-ed-dîn, dit le Maître, pour cette construction, ce sont des ouvriers grecs qu'il faut prendre; pour la démolition, au contraire, les ouvriers turcs sont nécessaires; car la construction du monde est spéciale aux Grecs, et la démolition de ce môme monde est réservée aux Turcs. Dieu, quand il a créé l'univers, a tout d'abord créé les infidèles insouciants; il leur a donné une longue vie et une force considérable, de manière que, à la façon des ouvriers à gages, ils s'efforcent, sans le savoir, de consiruire le monde terrestre; ils ont élevé de nombreuses villes, forteresses sur les sommets des montagnes, localités sur les hauteurs des collines, de manière qu'après des siècles écoulés, ces constructions servent de modèles aux hommes des derniers temps ; or, la prédestination divine a disposé les choses de telle sorte que petit à petit ces constructions deviennent des ruines; il a alors créé le peuple des Turcs pour démolir, sans respect ni pitié, toutes les constructions qu'ils voyaient ; ils l'ont fait ot le font encore; ils le feront de jour en jour jusqu'à la résurrection.Finalement, la destruction «le la ville de Qonya aura lieu par la main des Turcs injustes et impitoyables. » ] This opinion which should surprise, let alone offend no one except the Turks themselves was quite common among all the educated classes of the Seljuk Emirate or the Ottoman Empire. In their language (Osmalıca) the very word "Turk" was synonymous with "barbarian". Kemal's surrealist language "reform" destroyed Osmanlica but apparently it didn't do it perfectly enough.
Submitting....

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Reader comments (94) on this item

Title Commenter Date Thread
Islam is the religion of the Arabs only [74 words]
w/response from Daniel Pipes
edmond michaelsDec 22, 2015 00:54227212
Kurdistan [72 words]David W. LincolnMay 25, 2015 20:35223517
1Blame Bush [70 words]DaveApr 24, 2014 16:03214605
Turkey [192 words]KatieJun 14, 2011 00:44186303
I hope you are wrong [14 words]Manny MatamorosJun 13, 2011 13:42186276
6Right to choose [41 words]AbuSaad KhanJun 13, 2011 12:45186274
2Regular elections? [80 words]Naushad OmarJun 18, 2011 11:50186274
2A democracy is a step in the right direction but not enough. [222 words]PrashantJun 21, 2011 00:11186274
5ME expert... [74 words]aozturkJun 13, 2011 10:04186265
6Also concerned [154 words]AnnJun 13, 2011 08:59186264
9Welcome to Turkey ? [723 words]IanusJun 15, 2011 18:16186264
2Why not look at the mirror [51 words]BazoonahJun 16, 2011 13:54186264
4Not a little story at all ! [282 words]IanusJun 18, 2011 04:26186264
2Armenian genocide [35 words]Naushad OmarJun 18, 2011 11:59186264
1an Addon [181 words]BazoonahJun 20, 2011 04:17186264
8Ask Allah.He knows best why Israel is so successful and Moslems such a failure, doesn't he ? [238 words]IanusJun 29, 2011 13:15186264
4Ignorance and Greed - Turkey's two eternal allies in the West [537 words]IanusJun 29, 2011 14:21186264
8Alert for Turksih propagandists: Our dear Naushad is saying that there was really an Armenian Genocide! [138 words]dhimmi no moreJun 30, 2011 05:55186264
The coming Islamic empire. [102 words]Naushad OmarJul 9, 2011 18:58186264
Arab Superiority? [105 words]Naushad OmarJul 9, 2011 19:04186264
3Dictatorship and Islamism go hand in hand [232 words]PrashantJul 10, 2011 18:20186264
6Islam is the religion of the arabs only [291 words]dhimmi no moreJul 12, 2011 07:39186264
2freedom was their right [28 words]Ravi Ranjan Singh Bharat PanthiJul 21, 2011 14:28186264
4Turkey IS gone from the western orbit, if it has ever really been a part of it to begin with.... [114 words]Adina Kutnicki, IsraelJun 13, 2011 06:12186262
10some respect to our choice [100 words]ahmetJun 14, 2011 02:28186262
1the freedom to leave islam [82 words]MikeJun 15, 2011 04:09186262
5Imam Edrogan's party [194 words]IanusJun 15, 2011 18:45186262
7Turkey is a 99,8% Islamic monoculture.Let's face it at last ! [305 words]IanusJun 15, 2011 20:01186262
3Islamic tolerance and christian love. [82 words]Naushad OmarJun 18, 2011 12:12186262
6What is really a Genocide as per UN and the crimes of Turkey and its bloody past [170 words]dhimmi no moreJun 18, 2011 16:38186262
5Do kafirs have a right to self-defence against Moslem aggression ? [552 words]IanusJun 19, 2011 18:51186262
3Another victim Arabian imperialism and of Islam [553 words]dhimmi no moreJun 20, 2011 07:25186262
110% of the middle east is still Christian [126 words]PrashantJun 20, 2011 23:53186262
1Christian conversion in midlle east was incremental and slow. [118 words]Naushad OmarJun 22, 2011 12:49186262
2al-wali wa al-mawali and what a disgrace [76 words]dhimmi no moreJun 22, 2011 19:05186262
No blame [56 words]sephardiJun 24, 2011 19:19186262
1Islam, the beautiful religion [135 words]Naushad OmarJun 25, 2011 14:38186262
2Muslims killed 90 M hindus? True or false. [682 words]Naushad OmarJun 25, 2011 15:16186262
3Monotheism is a "much ado about nothing" [526 words]PrashantJun 26, 2011 00:43186262
2Another Turkish propagandist [194 words]dhimmi no moreJun 26, 2011 05:31186262
2el-komidyya el-islamiyya goes on and on [679 words]dhimmi no moreJun 26, 2011 06:49186262
1el-komidyya el-islamiyya goes on and on revisited [226 words]dhimmi no moreJun 26, 2011 08:17186262
1990M Hindus were killed by muslims during jihad in India [1447 words]dhimmi no moreJun 26, 2011 13:56186262
1Reponse to dhimmi no more [131 words]sephardiJun 26, 2011 22:00186262
2Hatred and prejudice only lead to bitterness and blindness [389 words]MehmetJun 27, 2011 21:03186262
4The Turkish crimes against humanity [717 words]dhimmi no moreJun 28, 2011 06:27186262
2Turkey and its crimes against humanity [634 words]dhimmi no moreJun 28, 2011 07:22186262
2individualized middle classes replacing monolithic ethnic blocks [317 words]MehmetJun 29, 2011 02:33186262
4The ugliness of Islam [119 words]IanusJun 29, 2011 13:38186262
You don't have any government documentation that proves Turks did genocide [217 words]sephardiJun 29, 2011 14:01186262
2we are all Armenians and get used to it [774 words]dhimmi no moreJun 29, 2011 18:00186262
6we are all Armenians and get used to it and the Armenian Genoicde and those that deny it and shame on them [732 words]dhimmi no moreJul 1, 2011 05:57186262
You don't even know what makes something official for a government [168 words]sephardiJul 1, 2011 18:45186262
5Confession of the criminal is not needed to establish the authorship of a crime [1789 words]IanusJul 2, 2011 11:01186262
1Armenian Genocide does not exist [243 words]sephardiJul 2, 2011 19:54186262
2Poor Turks! They are so allergic to the truth. [453 words]IanusJul 5, 2011 02:20186262
3Our dear Sephardi has nothing to say and shame on anyone who denies the Armenian Genocide [725 words]dhimmi no moreJul 5, 2011 08:04186262
5Jalal ad-Din Rumi on Turks [1116 words]IanusJul 6, 2011 14:44186262
Turks won't accept imaginary Armenian Genocide [139 words]sephardiJul 6, 2011 22:22186262
2Republic Of Turkey, MInistry Of Foreign Affairs: The Armenian Allegation Of Genocide The Issue And The Facts [3684 words]sephardiJul 7, 2011 23:31186262
2Our dear Sephardi is unable to refute the legal case against Turkey in regard to the Armenian Genocide. Shame on Turkey [809 words]dhimmi no moreJul 8, 2011 06:55186262
2Our dear Sephardi the Turkish Propagandist tells us that he has government documents! Where are they? Propaganda does not count [277 words]dhimmi no moreJul 9, 2011 06:04186262
Sephrdi - A Typical Genocide Denier [51 words]Young MCJul 10, 2011 19:23186262
1The Armenian Genocide and those that deny it! Shame on them! [694 words]dhimmi no moreJul 20, 2011 07:16186262
5The barbarian and the civilized [188 words]dhimmi no moreJul 20, 2011 13:43186262
Turkey's Predicament - How to Have a Future in Spite of Its Past [384 words]M. ToveyJul 29, 2011 18:19186262
Hijrath appeal will help to evacuate bad Muslims from India [387 words]Islamic AhimsaSep 11, 2011 00:45186262
Do you have any proof to support your claims? [26 words]AdilOct 20, 2014 14:38186262
4The Hindu Genocide revisited [514 words]dhimmi no moreOct 22, 2014 17:14186262
Real proof [55 words]AdilOct 25, 2014 15:12186262
And what about the Christian Imperialism in India [99 words]AdilOct 26, 2014 17:40186262
1Our dear Adil admits that millions of Hindus were murdered by the Muslim invaders of India! [476 words]dhimmi no moreOct 28, 2014 07:54186262
1Why do you live among kuffar our dear Adil and not in Saudi Arabia? Social benefits? No? [138 words]dhimmi no moreOct 28, 2014 17:31186262
1It is a spectrum Adil [159 words]PrashantOct 28, 2014 17:41186262
2My evidence that Islam is the religion of the Arabs only? For the nth time Q14:4 and 10:47 and 13:8 and 35:24 and 28:75 [482 words]dhimmi no moreOct 29, 2014 07:25186262
Where does it say in any history textbooks that 90,000,000 Hindus died because of Islam? [16 words]AdilOct 31, 2014 12:20186262
That is what I find bad.......... [28 words]AdilOct 31, 2014 12:22186262
2You still did not answer my question why do you live among Christian "imperialists"? [76 words]dhimmi no moreNov 2, 2014 08:31186262
3The Hindu Genocide revisited again [52 words]dhimmi no moreNov 2, 2014 08:35186262
1What of Turkey's Foreign Relations? [55 words]Peter HerzJun 13, 2011 05:42186261
1Expert Accountability [150 words]
w/response from Daniel Pipes
kzndrJun 12, 2011 22:38186257
Islamist Parties Abroad [109 words]Sir Daniel M. J. TobinJun 12, 2011 17:37186247
5Election results did not meet PM Erdoğan's expectations [32 words]somaJun 12, 2011 16:44186242
This is a wrongheaded analysis [117 words]
w/response from Daniel Pipes
Jeff H.Jun 12, 2011 14:02186235
11When was the first "fair and free election" in Turkey,I wonder ? [928 words]IanusJun 13, 2011 17:03186235
17Turkey the land of delusions [104 words]dhimmi no moreJun 14, 2011 06:57186235
1You seem to know what you are talking about but you dont have a clue actually [418 words]JohnJun 14, 2011 10:39186235
5Freedom of speech in Turkey would mean the end of Kemal's personality cult [1857 words]IanusJun 15, 2011 05:15186235
5"He insults Turkishness.Let's hire an underage murderer to kill him!" [537 words]IanusJun 16, 2011 17:00186235
11Turkey the land of delusions part deux [1059 words]dhimmi no moreJun 17, 2011 07:21186235
5Turkey - the land of paranoia (Armenian separatism without Armenians and Jewish land grab in Turkey without Jews) [767 words]IanusJun 17, 2011 15:59186235
2What is true of Turkey is true to all Islamic countries and societies [276 words]PrashantJun 17, 2011 18:04186235
3The wikileak and Turkey is indeed the land of delusions [62 words]dhimmi no moreJun 19, 2011 18:21186235
199 new names for Islam [154 words]IanusJun 20, 2011 07:58186235

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