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Confession of the criminal is not needed to establish the authorship of a crime

Reader comment on item: Turkey's Last Free Election
in response to reader comment: You don't have any government documentation that proves Turks did genocide

Submitted by Ianus (Poland), Jul 2, 2011 at 11:01

sephardi wrote :

" Give me one single official document that proves that Turks did genocide to any nation especially to Armenians, do not give reference a book that claims Turks did genocide, show us any countries official documentation that proves Turks did genocide.<

Take a look at the extensive collection of official Imperial German documents concerning the extermination of Armenians in the Ottoman Empire

"Deutschland und Armenien , 1914-1918 Sammlung diplomatischer Aktenstücke ",Tempelverlag Potsdam 1919

Note the date 1919 (April). The book of 668 pages is freely available online. It contains dispatches, cables and reports of the German government officials(ambassadors, consuls, vice-consuls , envoys, military attaches, etc. ) to the German government : the Foreign Office, Reich Chancellary etc. It is worth noting also that this is a source from Turkey's closest wartime ally and friend so that it can hardly be suspected or accused of bias or hostility towards Turkey as might be the case of Entente sources.

Note furthermore that the confession of the perpetrator is in no legal system expected, needed or essential to establish the authorship of a crime.

And ,frankly, who in his senses can expect a confession of crimes coming from Turks whose notoriety for lying and denying is widely known ? Or perhaps can you as a Turk admit a single crime, a single genocide, a single massacre provoked and perpetrated by the Turks during their long criminal and barbarian history ?

Anyway, I'd like to adduce some quotations from the documents to demonstrate the grim reality Turks keep collectively denying :

German Imperial Viceconsul M. Kuckhoff in Samsun 5th July 1915

What is involved here is nothing less than EXTERMINATION or forced Islamisation of a whole nation. The way the deportation order is being carried out threatens to assume forms for which the only analogy is the persecution of Jews in Spain and Portugal...In the vicinity of Samsun all the villages have been Islamized nd the same is true of Unieh" (p.104-105)

[ Kaiserlich Deutsches Vizekonsulat Samsun M. Kuckhoff den 5. Juli 1915

"Es handelt sich um nichts weniger als um die VERNICHTUNG oder gewaltsame Islamisierung eines Volkes... Die Art der Ausführung des Verbannungsbefehls droht Formen anzunehmen, die nur in der Judenverfolgung Spaniens und Portugals ein Gleichnis finden...In der Umgebung von Samsun sind alle Dörfer muhammedanisiert worden, ebenso in Unieh..." p.104-105]

German Imperial Embassy Pera , February, 16 , 1917 Ambassador Richard von Kühlmann

The annihilation of the Armenians has been carried out on a large scale …as a global result this policy of extermination (Ausrottungspolitik) has done much harm to the Turkish state. The atrocities of the anti-Armenian campaign will stain for a long time to come the very name of Turkey and they will provide mighty arguments to those that deny Turkey any character of a civilized country. (p. 321)

[ Kaiserlich-Deutsche Botschaft Pera den 16. Februar 1917 Botschafter Richard von Kühlmann

Die im grossen Umfange durchgeführte Armeniervernichtung …als Gesamtergebnis hat die Ausrottungspolitik dem türkischen Staate schwer geschadet. Die Greuel des Armenierfeldzuges werden schon lange auf dem türkischen Namen lasten und noch lange denjenigen Waffen liefern , die der Türkei die Eigenschaft eines Kulturstaates absprechen …]

German Evangelical Missionary Aid Malatia 26.03. 1917

"The losses of the Armenian people since the deportations in the summer until now have exceeded one million. A part of them have been killed in prisons after horrifying tortures. Women and children perished mostly underway to their deporation destinations because of hunger, epidemics and murder" . p.353

[ Deutsche evangelische Missionshilfe Malatia Malatia den 26.Marz 1917

"Die Verluste des armenischen Volkes seit der Verschickung Sommer 1915 bis heute übersteigen eine Million. Ein Teil wurde in den Gefängnissen nach fürchterlichen Folterqualen getötet. Von Frauen und Kinder starben die meisten auf dem Wege in die Verbannung, an Hunger, Seuche und Mord" p.353]

"From the Black Sea to Syria the name of Christianity has been wiped out, their churches have been closed , their schools emptied, their priests and preachers killed or deported. Except for a few Levant cities all Anatolia has been Islamized. Christian names have been deleted in the registers and replaced with Mahommetan names." p. XXXVII

[Vom Schwarzen Meer bis nach Syrien ist der Christenname ausgelöscht, die Kirchen geschlossen ,die Schulen entleert, die Priester und Prediger getötet oder verschickt. Von einigen Levantestädten abgesehen ist ganz Anatolien Islamisiert worden. Die christlichen Namen sind in den Registern ausgelöscht und durch muhammedanische ersetzt" p. XXXVII ]

As you can see, the documents call the events they are describing with quite unambiguous terms "planmässige Vernichtung des armenischen Volkes" ('premeditated and methodical extermination of the Armenain nation") , "systematische Vernichtung der Deportierten", ("systematic annihiltion of the deportees"), "Armeniervernichtung" ("extermination of the Armenians" ) , "Ausrottungspolitik" , ("policy of extermination") or quite literally "die grosste Christenverfolgung aller Zeiten" ( "the biggest persecution of Christians of all times"). Incidentally, the places were Armenians were imprisoned and tormented are called "concentration camps" ="Konzentrationslager" .

> Anything you are saying is uneducated and can't be proven, you just blame based on nothing, ohh sorry you read to books which are 1. A crime of silence. The Armenians genocide Permanent Peoples' Tribunal. Preface by Prof Pierre Vidla-Naquet Published by Z books 1985<

This is what you definitely don't read nor have any idea of most documents on the subject. But being a Turk what can you know anyway? No Turkish library has these documents or makes them accessible to the Turkish public, no Turkish newspaper or TV channel ever mentions or discusses them, no quotations are allowed, dissent and skepticism are severely punished. For showing them you would be imprisoned for 3 years on charges of "denigrating Turkishness" (Article 301) , as you know better than me.In other words, you as a Turk are the last person on this planet to even raise the Armenian question", let alone tell us what really happened and what didn't , you Turkish lie machine !

> 2. Genocide by Leo Kuper who was a Jurist and he explains the UN definition of genocide and the case of the Armenian Genocide Yale Imiversity press 1981<

and this books proves that Turks did Genocide based on non official documentation, I can only laugh that.<

I am sure you have never read or wanted to read any serious book or document on the subject. And your Turkish laughter has something mixed in it. It's both diabolical and imbecile because I am also quite sure that if confronted you will never recognize any official documentation either and that your demand to submit you some is fraudulent and insincere from the very beginning. And you will deny the official German reports as you deny any other serious documents pertaining to the subject.

> You have to prove the genocide based on official government documentation.<

The book I mention does it and quite well and as early as April 1919 , i.e. long before the Kemalist phase of the genocide began with the Armenian-Kemalist war of 1920 and its horrors, with burning Amrenains alive in their churches in Smyrna, with the cleansing of Cilicia of the last Armenian villages. And again why do you demand something which you will a priori deny?

>Do you know U.S send it inspector to Ottoman o see and do evaluation what is happening during WW1. <

Do you know that the book mentioned has the following report from 12.08.1916 "from Washington we learned that the Turkish government has denied the US request to form a neutral committee of relief for Syria where thousands of inhabitants (Armenians) are dying of hunger" ? (Ibidem p. 287 )

> Do you know what is the result of evaluations, Turks are not killing Armenians, Actually Armenian terrorist groups are killing both Armenians and Turks.<

My question to you. If the massacres of the Armenians are allegedly related to their "terrorist activities", "uprisings", "killing Turks", "conspiring with the enemy" , then why didn't the Turks apply the same "Ausrottungspolitik" towards the Arabs for doing exacty the same crime , nay on even a much bigger and more dangerous scale? Or maybe you have never heard of the Arab terrorists of Emir Faisal spying, ambushing and killing Turkish soldiers in Arabia, conspiring with Turkey's mortal enemy, capturing one Ottoman province after another,taking foreign money and military instructors?

Anyway name the source! The fact is that American archives do tell a different story from your claims ,even though they confirm that the US government for a long time did its best to intentionally conceal the information it had on the Armenian genocide from the American public.

On February, 12th 1916 the Department of State sent a cable to the US embassy in Constantinople where it said

"Inform the Turkish government has received and is still receiving information …giving detailed accounts of the sufferings which have accompanied and resulted from the systematic expulsion of the Armenians from their homes and other mistreatments which thez have undergone.. The department at the present time is considering the question whether or not it I justified in longer withholding from the American people the facts now in its possession."

>I will repeat my self again show us one single government documentation that Turks did genocide.<

Inspect again carefully the official German documentation to have what you allegedly want .

> By the way Armenia was the first Country to recognize Republic of Turkey in the world.<

This not true. The first country to recognize Kemal's regime (no one knows what this rebellious Kemalist territory was constitutionally before October 29, 1923 ) was Soviet Russia that opened up its Embassy in Angora on November 7th 1920. It was for a long time the only foreign legation in Kemal-controlled territory.

Anyway, if by "recognition" you mean signing at the point of Turkish guns the treaty of Alexandroupolis with Armenia after numberless atrocities and massacres against the Armenians committed by the Kemalists, then first it happened later than the opening of teh Soviet Ambassy in Angora - on 2.12.1920.Second the Dashnak government that was forced to sign it had previously given up its power to the Soviet Russians and thus had no legal power to do what it did to end Kemalist atrocities on Armenian soil and thus it created no de jure or even de facto recognition of the Kemalist regime. And interestingly enough , on 4.12.1920 the Red Army occupied Erivan and one of the first things it did was to declare the above-mentioned treaty as null and void and Kemalists didn't protest at all. The final regulation of the Turkish-Soviet borders took place in Moscow in February and March 1921 resulting in the Soviet-Kemalist Treaty of Brotherhood and Friendship (16.03.1921) and later in the Treaty of Kars of 13.10.1921.


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w/response from Daniel Pipes
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199 new names for Islam [154 words]IanusJun 20, 2011 07:58186235

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