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myopic worldviews

Reader comment on item: Israel and Clear Victory
in response to reader comment: Silence in Muslim World

Submitted by the Grand Infidel of Kaffiristan (Australia), Jan 19, 2009 at 20:30

Abdulrahman writes:

"The war in Darfur is completely wrong and who said that we in the muslim world are silenced by our own will ... I'll tell you one thing about muslims and the arabs in genral .."

Good that you see that - but what are you doing about it other than talking about it in a forum where you can lead people to believe that at least one Muslim has some concerns?

Why don't we see protests from those Muslim minorities who now live freely in western countries - where they are free to protest? Can you point me to one instance where Muslims in western countries have actively protested against the Sudanese government (or any other government) about the killings in Sudan? Why is it that non-Muslm groups like Medicins Sans Frontieres and Amnesty International have to do all the lodbbying and raising of public awareness against this blight on humanity?

" ......The rulers,the governments and every man in power in the arab countries are not the reflection of the arabs living in their countries...."

there is a saying - people get the governments they deserve. Why are governments throughout the Islamic world so consistently beset by problems? What is the one common factor?

"...In fact we suffer a life of dictatorship and if someone go against the president he is done .. But in fact this life is much more better than having occuping forces on our land in the name of fighting terrorism cuz they are not fighting terrorism they are fighting us and destroying peace.. "

Here we go - change the subject and blame somebody - no doubt America in this case. Ask the Iraqis if they'd prefer to have the Saddam regime back.

"......And wars have never solved problems."

Pity Hamas and Hezbollah, Al Quds brigade , Chechens etc don't share your sentiment.

"....So the silence about Darfaur war is a reflection of the dictatorship ruling and not the muslims... "

But the dictators are Muslims - so are their cronies and all their hangers-on. So are their families. No one is doing anything. They are either comfortable with it or turn a blind eye - or even promote it. Why aren't the mullahs or imams in Sudan doing or saying anything about it? Wouldn't you call a society that allows this to happen, backward?

".....It's just the rulers can't prevent our nations from sympathy with the peoples of Gaza against a foreign intruder "

Because they are mostly all Muslims right? What if they were non-Muslim Eskimos - would you care?That is the point - your sympathy is selective - because you think the people believe what you believe.

".....or there will be revolution and that's what we need here but we can't do it cuz we don't want another country to come and mess us up ..."

revolution involves major and drastic change - so you have to be prepared for that if you really want it. Otherwise things will go on as they always have - in fact - they will get worse. There is no guarantee of a positive outcome either - because the 'solution' might be worse than the problem. (viz Russian revolution) but it is the risk you have to take.

" ........And do you realy think that Israel has accomplished it's goals by killing these civilians... Well it hasn't accomplished anything but killing..."

Its goal was never to kill civilians - why suggest otherwise?It's aim was to cripple Hamas. It has done that.

"And im not against anyone no matter what his religion is ..."

What made you think that that was an option in the first place?

".....and that's something i've learned from my Islam.."

Any religion will tell you that - but that is more remarkable in your case - as your Islam is very pointed on breaking the world up into infidels and kaffirs isn't it? Maybe you've misunderstood what you have been reading - and happily actually ended up with a partially viable philosophy that works well for you..

".. Non-muslims have the rights as muslims in my religion but we are just told to tell them about our religion... "

Good - and if they're not interested - don't keep harping the point - and don't get frustrated and group together with other frustrated co-religionists working out ways to shove it down other people's throats.

"....And we are not told to blow ourselves in civilian targets like terrorists do and mind corrupting plays a great role in that..."

Some are, and some have been and some will be. In fact - maybe some are not even told - but because of their brainwashing and confusion and in the fervour of their whipped up mental/emotional states - they actually offer it. What does it take to get 19 guys to commit suicide together by flying a plane into a building and take out 3000 innocent people ? What an interesting group dynamic . How did they arrive at the conclusion that that was what Allah wanted and that it would further their cause - however insane that cause was? And remember - this was after most of them had spent a year amongst US citizens. That's 19 people - count off the next 19 people you meet - and imagine trying to get them to do something like that? What crazy philosophy could you give them that would get them to commit something like that - without the use of copious amounts of psychedelics?

".....In fact if you lived in an arab country you would completely know that muslims are not terrorists and the media just make the Islam is the basic religion of terrorism .."

So it's the media's fault now? The media report facts - some may do so with some bias. Eg. if you go to any Iranian website - or a UK Muslim website - you will see a lot of bias against Israel and the US. But all media in all countries make reports based on facts. The facts are that there are no significant terrorist acts anywhere in the world that do not feature Muslims as major players (apart from the small, localaised and dwindling number of communist FARQ 'freedom' fighters in p Columbia, South America.)

".....And it's not .. If you just think it out and gathered more information about Islam and the Quran you would know it's the truth and everything is written in the Quran is no doubt right "

You believe that and good luck to you - but humans are very, very good at self-deception.

... The problem is you are not trying to do that and you think you are right so we are all wrong and that's not a way of knowing the truth..."

You might have read one of the sayings by the founder of another religion - who said 'by their fruits ye shall know them'. That is good advice - and that is enough.

"........So we (the muslims) don't hate anyone no matter his religion is and we are told to treat non-muslims the same as muslims and they have the same rights.."

Right, nice theory, pity about the practice. Not all Muslims think and certaqinly do not act that way . Some are content to misunderstand their religion and devote their lives to making sure it gets to be the 'supreme religion' at whatever cost.

I mean , after investing all their youth and time and in a madrassa developing some incredibly myopic and exquisitely neurotic worldview - wouldn't you want a pay-off of some sort? I mean, you've been reading and have been told all your life - that what you believe in - what's happening in your brain - is THE supreme 'Truth'? How could you possibly concede that others have equally if not more valid philosophies?

"You might ask christians living in our countries how they are treated by muslims .. "

depending on which Muslim country you are talking about - but Christians in Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, Sudan, even Turkeyand Egypt certainly have problems.

".....I have alot of christian friends myself and we trust each other greatly... "

I have a few Muslim friends too. Though it is important - we are not talking about having a few friends here and there. What it boilds down to is we are talking about people having a belief system that has no checks and balances - wherein people can be led to believe it is quite OK to blow yourself and/or others up - because you think they are thinking incorrectly. In an other wise relatively sane society - why would you want to allow people like that to live amongst you - why even give it the chance to flourish?

".....And what Im writing here is the reflection of every muslim living in the middle east .. we are not politicians but we just want peace and that's what all peoples want .. We want to live a life of peace wit other peoples not to produce hatress to them...."

You might think like that - but again - all Muslims don't. I live in a peaceful and prosperous western country. Even a group of Muslims living here have been charged with plotting serious terrorist actions. There is a huge amount of evidence against this one particular group. The leader of this group a self-styled imam - has been living here for 19 years on social security benefits - funded by the taxpayers. Deciding to blow up infrastructure in the name of 'jihad' was how he was going to pay back society for its hospitaility.

".....And my religion is the only true religion on Earth and that's something I've been studying for long.. "

so you would say that wouldn't you- but it is wrong. It's just what you believe. No religion is higher than truth. I can understand your anger and disappointment when you get disagreement from other people - but facts are facts.

"I've looked at other religions and my conclusion brought me back to my religion ... "

"You might look this up and ask yourself "why this guy and all muslims are holding their religion so tight and it appears to me it's so wrong??"...

It's the frog in the well syndrome - it's the only world you know. And it also has a lot to do with fear and the rules of the Islamic game. What is stopping you leaving Islam? Other Muslims.

And the superstition that you will go to hell etc if you change (open) your mind.

. Doesn't the Koran recommend death or similar for making that move?


"....And you might search for the answers and compare religions..."

been there, done that

"......Thanks and may Allah guide you"

'Allah' did guide me and the advice given leads to me here today - to tell you that Islam is not the supreme revelation of truth, Mohammed was certainly not the last prophet (if a prophet at all) and that truth is an experience inside you.

Submitting....

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Note: Opinions expressed in comments are those of the authors alone and not necessarily those of Daniel Pipes. Original writing only, please. Comments are screened and in some cases edited before posting. Reasoned disagreement is welcome but not comments that are scurrilous, off-topic, commercial, disparaging religions, or otherwise inappropriate. For complete regulations, see the "Guidelines for Reader Comments".

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