2 readers online now  |  69 million page views

Protocols of the fraudsters

Reader comment on item: "Jewish" - Not the Same as "Pro-Israel"
in response to reader comment: Koran?

Submitted by Martin Horan (United Kingdom), Oct 29, 2009 at 21:03

Ivar's comments are slightly illogical. I do not hold that a whole nation should be killed for a few. But Ivar's illogical rant does not stop wiith that ad honinem accusation. I wonder if he has actually read the vile thing, "The Protocols of the Elders of Zion," which, at a cursory glance, can be seen by any logical person to be a glaring fraud.
If Ivar were to read "The Secret History of the Jesuits" or the writings of former Jesuit Father Diego Riviera, who spoke of assassination attempts on his life for exposing that fraternenty, he would find out who the true authors of the so-called Jewish book really were. (History alone attests to what the Jesuits were and are. There are plenty of historical classics on that order, such as Nicolini's "History of the Jesuits." And Paris and Riviera are not the only former Jesuits to have stated that The "Protocals" were a hoax to stir up hatred against the Jews. And it worked as history again attests. Ivar's own hatred of Jewish people shows that--and he can't even see it.)

How could a group of Jews at that time plan to take over the world? Not only such a minority, but a persecuted and despised minority most of whom lived in abject poverty in the ghettos and shtetls of the Western world. The Jews were actually gated in the ghettos and banned by the Catholic church from even having trades. The Catholic church forced them to wear certain distinguishing clothing, and also made them were a yellow badge, later copied by Hitler. The papacy also forced the Jews into usury--by Law! Historical FACTs, Ivar.

I know more about Jewish history and culture than probably all of my Jewish friends. Educated in the Catholic church, I know more of Catholic history than most Catholics I know, (I'm an MA in history). My point here: most Jews have never even heard of "The Protocals" anymore than most so-called Protestants know the Bible, or Catholics know of the Inquisition or of the Borgias or any real Catholic history--the latter not being taught it in their schools. I knew nothing of Catholic history until I left school.(Muslims, on the other hand know their Korans and Hadiths because it is a prerequisite to an education for all Muslims to learn both, especially the Koran which it is incumbent for them to know by heart. )

Zionism is purely Jewish, is it!? By that logic, Israelis are not Zionists, then, because most of them are agnostics and atheists, not Jews.
A Zionist is anyone who loves Israel, whatever his background. I love Israel because when I was raised in Catholicism it was the ONLY country in the Middle-East where I could have gone and practised Catholicism openly; in spite of the Catholic church's history of anti-Semitism, which is even worse than that of Islam--so far!

When I became an agnostic, Israel was still the only place in the Middle-East where I could openly decry religion. Same thing when I became an atheist. When I became a Bible-believing Christian, it was the only place--still--in the Middle-East where I could openly practise what I believed.
Zionists ruling the world today!? Is that why the world's media is so hateful towards Israel and only shows the Arab side? Even under Reagan the US were helping to arm the Arabs. We British were doing it, after reneging on the Balfour Declaration and staffing Arab armies with our own officers.
If the Zionists--whom Ivar equates only with Jews (showing his own blind and irrational hatred of his fellow human beings)-- when many of us personally know Jews who are not ZIonists (Henry Kissinger being the prime example),

If Zionists rule the world, how come they cannot get their influence into the media to explain real historical facts--viz., that the Arabs sent a delegation to the UN as late as 1956 claiming that "Palestine" was a Jewish myth and that there was never any such people? How come the Zionists can't get the media to tell the world that "Palestinians" only started calling themselves by the name the indigenous Jews of the Middle East called themselves till 1948 after Israel defeated the Arabs in the Six-Day War in 1967?

How come the Zionists cannot get the world's media to point out that after the British cut up the Middle East they handed over what had been Jewish lands to the Arabs? How come the Zionists, if they rule the world, cannot get the lists of psychopathic murders that happen daily to ordinary Israelis mentioned in the world's media? How come best-selling books by Christian writers like Christina Wertheim, Dave Hunt, John Haggie, Derek Prince, David Hathaway, James Prasch, Gary Kah, Jeffrey A. Baker, Alan Franklin (I could go on and on and on) and many of whom live in and/or have ministries in Israel, who witness these atrocities and expose them in their books, cannot get a mention of these things in the world's media?
I wonder if Ivar has read any of their books!

Ivar tries a bit of casuitry after claiming that the Zioinst rule the world if I can name any Muslims who do? Of course, the zillionaire Arabs, he must believe, are actually Jewish Zionists! The people who control the oil fields of the Middle East cannot be Arabs in his mind, judging by his ridiculous statement. These oil Zillionaires live in luxury undreamt of by most people while they keep their fellow Muslims and Arabs living in poverty. That, of course, means nothing to Ivar.

Either Ivar does not know the difference between instances and evidence, evidence and facts, and facts and proof. Or he thinks his readers don't. If the latter's the case he has a very low opinion of other people's intelligence.
The only proof he gives us is that he either cannot reason logically or he thinks the rest of us can't and will fall for his cant, if you pardon the pun.
But here's the proof of how he is one or the other (and on a par with any Muslim or Nazi): "How much love does hold a Jewish heart (sic) when he (she) is killing down pregnant women and chiildren?"
He wrote it, I am only quoting what he actually wrote.

So he is implying that Jews are "killing down" pregnant women and children. Says who? "Palestinians" who we can't even believe because they show they are outright liars and frauds who twist history to claim that they are "Palestinians." Arafat their leader wasn't even an Arab, he was an Egyptian. Hello! An Egyptian who was sent by Abdul Nasser to overthrow King Hussein of Jordan. That caused King Hussein to kick these Arabs our of Jordan and, having nowhere to go, Israel gave them Gaza--Gaza which could have fed all their people as it was the breadbasket of Israel itself. Instead, out of spite, these so-called Palestinians destroyed all the Kibutzes that Israelis had built by their own sweat and blood. And Gaza became a springboard of terror against unarmed civilians, Arabs and Jews. That's how Israel was rewarded for giving these people land.
Before Ivar quotes terrorist propaganda, he should ask himself what kind of people send their very own children across minefields to clear mines for their advancing armies? Or what kind of people train their own children to be suicide bombers? Yes, their own children! Not even the Jew-loathing Nazis did that.

Interestingly, it is not Jewish journalists I have got this from (I was a journalist) but from Christian ones reporting in the Middle East who know far more than Ivar knows. All Ivar's arguments are blatant suppositions. And he doesn't know that they are or he would not be making them. Unlesss, he's just hoping the rest of us are to ignorant and stupid to see it.

Then Ivar takes a high-handed approach as if he is above the rest of humanity. His rationale is all a bit woolly and sounds like he's been reading some New Age stuff, none of which can be argued from logic. Everyone is to drop their paradigms--this is from a person who has an anti-Semitic paradigm based on a bogus book, exposed as a fraud, not only by (non-Jewish) philosophers and historians but by Jesuits themselves. He has a paradigm that the Zionists rule the world which of itself shows that he doesn't feel he needs to change that paradigm. This dogmatist tells us we should get rid of "all this dogmatic stuff"--which is a bit like the pope saying we should get rid of Catholicsm--and that we should all widen our minds (his own being so wide to include everyone else--except Jews!)

I would agree with him regarding religion, as did the first Christians--who were all Jewish! But religious people are not small groupsas Ivar maintains. If they were there would be less problems in the world.
And he tells us he has learned to love everyone--not including Jews and Zionists, of course, which is one and the same thing to Ivar, as he himself has already told us.
He ends by telling us it is time for a change. What kind of a change? He doesn't say. Germany was told that by Hitler, Britain was told it by Blair. Hitler brought about Germany's downfall and Blair has brought about ours (Britain's) as Obama's about to bring about America's. Obama, remember, talked all the time in his election speeches about change. He did not go into detail either. One thing we do know is that he always sides with the Araba against Israel. If the most powerful man in the world can do that how can Zionists rule the world? Russia is a blatantly anti-Semitic country. It has been arming Arab terrorists since they have existed. That's only Russia and America and Britain's the same. And, of course, the whole Arab and Muslim world--yet Zionists rule the world!!!
As to Ivar, I would say to him, it's not about changing paradigms per se, that's needed. It's making the paradigms fit the facts that's needed, not the other way round. ALL politically-minded and religious people make the facts fit the paradigms with their thinking--exactly as Ivar himslef is doing.
The root of anti-Semitism is spiritual. It cannot possibly be anything else because it is neither logical nor rational. Ivar's own argument is a perfect example of that. Anti-Semitism is only explained to us in one book and one book alone--the Bible; the New Testament as well as Old Testament warns of it. The Bible was written long before the Koran and the prophecies of the Koran's Islamic 1000 year reign did not happen. The Old Testament gives us hundreds of prophecies of the Jewish Messiah, most of which happened--ALL of the ones regarding His first coming. The scene is now set for His Second Coming--those prophecies regarding "Jacob's Trouble" when all the nations of the earth will come against Israel.
God promised the Jewish people and the Jewish people alone--not us Christians--that "those who bless you I will bless and those that curse you I will curse." If anyone can't see that, let them look at the history--even recent histories--of those who have persecuted God's physical people. Look at Germany, Russia, the Catholic nations and the Muslim nations.
The Bible names names--of peoples and nations. No other book does. All Israel's enemies are named and they are preparing, as the prophets and Jesus Christ Himself prophesied of them, to come against Israel in the last days. The one-world government is coming into being now, as only the Bible prophesied. My hope is that the Ivars of this world start to read it and realize it. If he wants "Palestinians" and their ilk to have peace and prosperity--as indeed I myself do--he is not going to see it, not this side of Armageddon. In fact, neither will the Jewish people until, Yeshua Ha Moshiach returns to fight for them. He has promised He will, and nothing can stand in His way. Woe betide those who try it.
All the "Great" empires Babylon, Assyria, Greece, Rome, &c., that persecuted and abused the Jews are dead and buried and remembered only by historians (as the Bible prophesied would happen to them). But the Jews are still here. God, through the prophets told the Jewish people, that they would be back in their land and the desert would bloom and their cities established. It's happened. There's the proof for those who can see it. Ivar is correct in the sense that humanity has learnt nothing. But there's only one place where he and anyone else can find the conclusion. It is in the Bible alone, the book through which God used the Jewish people to write for humanity.
Interesting that Ivar can exuse Sharia law and suicide bombers yet condemn Jews for defending themselves against such atrocities. Now there's proof in itself that anti-Semitism is spiritural. And it is a doctrine of demons, to use a New Testament term.

Submitting....

Note: Opinions expressed in comments are those of the authors alone and not necessarily those of Daniel Pipes. Original writing only, please. Comments are screened and in some cases edited before posting. Reasoned disagreement is welcome but not comments that are scurrilous, off-topic, commercial, disparaging religions, or otherwise inappropriate. For complete regulations, see the "Guidelines for Reader Comments".

Comment on this item

Mark my comment as a response to Protocols of the fraudsters by Martin Horan

Email me if someone replies to my comment

Note: Opinions expressed in comments are those of the authors alone and not necessarily those of Daniel Pipes. Original writing only, please. Comments are screened and in some cases edited before posting. Reasoned disagreement is welcome but not comments that are scurrilous, off-topic, commercial, disparaging religions, or otherwise inappropriate. For complete regulations, see the "Guidelines for Reader Comments".

See recent outstanding comments.

Follow Daniel Pipes

Facebook   Twitter   RSS   Join Mailing List

All materials by Daniel Pipes on this site: © 1968-2021 Daniel Pipes. daniel.pipes@gmail.com and @DanielPipes

Support Daniel Pipes' work with a tax-deductible donation to the Middle East Forum.Daniel J. Pipes

(The MEF is a publicly supported, nonprofit organization under section 501(c)3 of the Internal Revenue Code.

Contributions are tax deductible to the full extent allowed by law. Tax-ID 23-774-9796, approved Apr. 27, 1998.

For more information, view our IRS letter of determination.)