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You have some fundamental misunderstandings, Plato

Reader comment on item: How the West Could Lose
in response to reader comment: Noah, Tat twam asi. Muslim. And 500 million deaths. OM shanti, shanti

Submitted by Noah Wilk (United States), Feb 10, 2007 at 06:42

Plato wrote: ...

"I don't know how you guys, Noah and Susan, do it. Practically instant instant reposts to so many on this forum and pretty detailed ones too. Are you prosperous retired people. Tell me if I am right, if it is not a secret. Do you have a whole lot of people working for you on these posts?"

LOL! No, I just type really, really fast, and already know my arguments inside and out, plus I have a library of ready links, so posts are a lot easier than they appear. :-)

"I am having a tough time juggling time between work and moonlighting on this forum. Answering this particular post has my finger joints creaking, my wife screaming and my eyes watering...."

I gotta admit, it's taken a bite out of my free time late at night lately.

"If Gibbon is to be believed the Moors of Spain did a pretty good job for some time. It took Christianity around 1800 years to go from persecuted minority living in catacombs to inquisitors to genocidal invaders to finally settle down as freedom loving democracies. You have to wait and watch only for another 400 years."

The Moors forced Christians to live as second class citizens (ie dhimmis) and expelled Jews at various times.

And your comparison to Christianity damns Islam all the more. For Christianity to go from persecuted minority to genocidal invaders and then evolving into peace-loving democracies in that time frame is quite impressive. Islam on the other hand has always been a violent invader, starting 1,400 years ago and continuing until today. It's like they're stuck in a time warp, on "kill" mode.

"I believe Muslims are weak-kneed when protesting terrorism but the numbers you have quoted for pro-muslim issues are not very impressive. I am sure the numbers would have been higher. They probably feared targeted surveillance."

First, I believe they've been under-reported. Second, I doubt it's because they fear targetted surveillance. I think it's because they're trying to ";ay low" and avoid attracting to much attention, as any destructive criminal would. The point being, they show up more often and in larger numbers to '"defend" Islam (fromfabricated "threats") than they do in any way to reform their religion. In other words, announce that you're having an anti-terror rally and try to encourage Muslims to attend, and they don't. Let someone take a suspicious immam off an airplane and they come out in droves and are crying to the media.

"Your liberals fear offending the Muslim living among yourself but the polls indicated support for the war in Iraq, and Afghanistan."

Liberals are backing the war? What poll is that? Most Americans are against the war, liberal or otherwise.

"You have garrisons practically all over the ME"

Which should end immediately. We don't need soldiers on the ground to deal with the Muslims if they start trouble.

"Noah, you really have me worried there. The leader of the free world without a squirt of military training or even a squirt of common sense. What am I supposed to make of that."

The truth. Bush never served. He's a politician, not a soldier. At least when John Adams was president, he had the common sense to appoint Washington as commander-in-chief, because Adams had no military knowledge. I'd bet you money that Bush has never been in any sort of serious combat (personal assault, etc) in his life. He's about as qualified to run the military as Mother Theresa is.

"You spend billions every year for what and on who? You mean to tell me that all those soldiers have been training with toy guns and planes. Or that West Point turns out world class idiots? No wonder Bin Laden is relaxing on his silk pillows in his air-conditioned cave without a care. Now that is scary."

No, no. You're taking that wrong. I said that Bush and the people calling the shots in the war have no idea how to manage a war. Most of them have never seen combat. Let Dick Marcinko run the war, and it would have been over and settled inside 90 days. Our soldiers know how to fight. The problem is that they're stuck obeying idiot politicians who would have trouble figuring out which end of a rifle the bullets come out of.

"I am not sure but you have been trying for decades to keep out the Mexicans. What is the level of your success?"

Ah, but there is a fundamental and gaping flaw in your argument. We've never actively been trying to keep the Mexicans out. Ted Kennedy led the march for amnesty and lax enforcement of immigration back in the 60's and it's been a joke ever since. The problem is that we are not trying to keep the Mexicans out. The National Guard is stationed there with their thumbs stuck up their backsides because they're not allowed to shoot, to chase, or to apprehend criminal aliens. Our own border patrol is not allowed to pursue fleeing alien criminals. Our judges "catch and release". Enforcement is a joke. We're not failing, we're simply not trying.

" Muslims need not carry Muslim sounding names, nor will their passports indicate they are Muslims. You have your job cut out for you to keep out Muslims bent on terror."

For one thing, we ban immigration from any Islamic country or country with Islamic majorities. We ban all people of Middle eastern descent unless and until they can prove they are not Muslim. Yes, it takes work. America has gotten fat and lazy, that's the problem.

"Just thought control by another name. No different from Mo calling attacks on neighbouring countries 'changing its political dynamics'."

No, it is not thought control. We are not telling people what to think. We would be banning a socio-political cult movement that is hell bent on destroying our country. That's not thought control, it's common sense.

"I agree killing is the simple part. As to the others, I am no security specialist, but still it looks pretty simple-minded to me. But good luck to your strategising. You make it sound so simple."

Like I said, how to they get into America? We ban immigrants from Muslim countries. They cannot fly in or boat/ship in. There are no trains running across the ocean last I checked. No busses either. We have no common border for them to walk/drive/tunnel across. So how would they arrive? They don't have a Star Trek Starship that they can teleport in by.

"Starting from Bin Laden all the plotting was done outside of the US of A and implemented in it."

Relevant phrase..."implemented inside it". They won't be inside America in order to implement anything.

"You are speaking on behalf of the natives. Let one of the few surviving ones including those who are your friends come forward about what happened to their ancestors.What choice do the native Americans have?"

Again, this is irrelevant to the topic. We cannot change history, nor can we condone what was done. This does not justify Muslims coming to the country to destroy it. Two wrongs don't make a right. What is your purpose for constantly bringing it up? I have already admitted more than a few times that what we did to the Native Americans was horrendous and unjustifiable by any stretch of the imagination. But again, there is nothing we can do about it. We don't have time machines and therefore there is no point in discussing it. America has learned since then, just as we abolished slavery. We moved forward and formed the greatest country on earth where people enjoyed rights never before seen in the history of mankind.

"Yes I know you have that aspect of your strategy all nicely tied up and packaged. I will stop worrying only when I get a second opinion from another strategist who has had a close look at the ribbon you used to tie up your package and confirm the ribbon is strong enough to prevent the contents from spilling out."

Again, tell me what method they will use to get in if they cannot arrive in airplanes or on ships. They are on the other side of the world. They can't teleport. So how do they get in? We'd have the borders protected. I mean actual protection, not the joke it is now. How do they get in?

"I am trying to digest those figures you are tossing around. "

Pretty disturbing numbers, aren't they?

"There is also a feeling of de ja vu about your Hiroshima plot scenario. Researching that Muslim habit of blaming everyone around for what one or two did seems to have rubbed off on you."

How do you figure? It's absurd to say "what one or two did" when 70% of Jordanians favor using suicide bombings against Americans. I've never understood this compulsion to minimize the number of fanatics that constitute Islam. Is it a fear that if we admit the truth, that the vast majority are either violent or apologists for the violence, that we'll be forced to actually face the threat and deal with it?

"Oh yes. Now I remember the cartoon story where Muslims turned around and attacked the nearest Christian for what happened in a country they had not even heard about. You say Muslims pull off this plot. What you are not saying is if Al Qaeda or Pakistan pull this off."

I hardly think Al Qaeda or Pakistan pulled the strings. This is how Muslims around the world react all the time. Do the research.

"By your own estimate there are 1.2 billion of them scattered over the planet and they are, if not privy to the plot, certain to acqueisce. So Al Qaeda is Muslim, Pakistan is Muslim. Let us vaporise them and also Mecca Medina, Al Azhar, Tripoli, Jakarta, Kuala Lumpur, southern Thailand, Mindanao while we are about it.. A job well done. That is the very Muslim reaction you so detest."

Again, first we deport, ban, and isolate. The nukes will fly only if they somehow figure out a way to commit a massive terror attack against us, which would be nearly impossible since no Muslims would be around in the USA and they'd have no method for sneaking in.

"Because they need repeating. Now that still leaves 800 million Muslims alive, discounting the 100 million that died in the US"

First, remember that my method virtually insures against such a nuclear war. Second, if we nuked their population centers, they'd all die. Some from the blast, others from radiation sickness (if we used neutron bombs), the rest from starvation. Remember, neutron radiation would also kill plants and cattle. No doubt they would resort to cannibalism, but they're barely able to eek out an existence as it is, with millions and in some cases billions of dollars in foreign aid. So they would die out pretty readily. We could always help them along by spraying with nerve agents, napalm, firebombs, etc. It would be easy.

"I have assumed your bombs kill only the Muslims, so much more satisfying assuming only the instigators will be picked up by the explosions and radiation."

No, unfortunately some non-Muslims would also die. Such is the nature of war. It is unavoidable. I would hope that most non-Muslims would have the common sense to flee once the writing was on the wall. In any case, sacrifices must be made.

"I thought I gave a better solution with not a solitary Muslim alive and you dismissed it as wishful thinking"

Because you presented the idea of a virus that only kills Muslims or some such absurdity. Remember?

"Again, far better than 500,000,000, and compare that to how many we lost in one attack on 9/11.Yes that is a great bargain 2 million for 500 million. And an even better bargain just 20,000 deaths instead of 500 million. A master plan that can't be faulted. Every last detail worked out. Who can resist such a great bargain. But just a little niggling thought at the back of my mind that refuses to go away. If out of the 250 million or so Americans all the country could find are strategists and planners with not 'a squirt of common sense or military training' leading to the uneducated terrorist Muslims in Iraq running 150,000 of the best trained and armed troops in the world to the ground, where is the guarantee that you can get away with just 20,000 dead."

Put some real warriors in charge and the job will get done, trust me. Again, many of the generals and other leaders know how to conduct a war, they are just hand-tied by idiot politicians. That's why we lose. Warriors are good at breaking the enemy. Politicians are only good at breaking promises.

"Where is the guarantee that your new strategists will have a piffle more that a squirt of military training and commonsense? Stupid me, that's where you come in with your master plan to end all master plans."

Again, get rid of the idiot politicians who are sleeping with the Saudis and let some real patriotic American warriors run policy.

"Your plan must be way beyond brilliant as it guarantees only 20k casualties."

I never "guaranteed" anything. That's just a good estimate. It could be a little higher, it would probably be a lot lower. In any case, even if I were wrong by a hundred-fold, that would still be a drop in the bucket compared to the alternative where global nuclear war breaks out. In fact, it would be a drop in the bucket even compared to a situation in which America did not respond at all to a Muslim attack that took out LA, New York, and Chicago.

"As you have so kindly reminded me several times I am stupid and a fool to boot and as to common sense your strategists could do worse than me which is why I can't see the brilliance of your master plan. Or it is so brilliant that it hurts my eyes, I can't see."

Your posts start out kind, then descend into snottiness. Weird. Anyway, you simply refuse to listen to reason, that's why you don't see the brilliance of the plan. You want it to fail, you want it to be unworkable.

"All I can see through the flash of MOABs and neutron and nuclear bombs is 500 million dead, the figure you so thoughtfully provided. And still 800 million Muslims left standing."

I swear it is getting tedious having to repeat myself to you a trillion times. Please try a reading comprehension course. As I have laid out the plan, it minimizes to near zero the likelihood of any sort of nuclear attack by any side against any other. It virtually guarantees against nuclear war. On the other hand, not implementing my plan virtually assures it, as Islam is hell-bent on nuking both Israel and America, and we all know damned well where that leads. Why is it that you refuse to acknowledge this after I have spelled it out at least 4 times now?

As for the 800 million Muslims left, wrong again, as I have pointed out. First, Muslims tend to be densely packed in population centers. Tehran, for example, has 12 million + in the city and surrounding burbs. One blast, 12 million evaporated. There are 71 million in Iran alone. Riyadh has 4.2 million alone. Again, one bomb, 4.2 millon dead. That's 20% of the Saudi population. Again, densely packed people, 27 million in Saudi Arabia. Afghanistan 22.6 million, Algeria 29.2 million, Egypt 63.6 million. Right there are 213 million dead Muslims, either immediately or directly after from starvation, disease, and with help from American fighter pilots and drones. They'd have no infrastructure, no clean water, no food, and lots of disease from all the rotting bodies and weakened resistance. The aftermath would clean up what was left, and even if there were 500 million or even 800 million left, they'd be left struggling just to survive to the next day, deprived of weapons or access to America. All they could do is die off. Oh, and let's not forget Indonesia. There's another 200 million dead. Now we're up to 400 million of them dead.

"A long way to go before you can write 'The Last of the Muslims'"

Again, there would be no need to write off the "last of the Muslims". They'd be cut in half at least, and left with an apocalyptic disaster (which at least Iran would be happy with!), and they'd be deprived of any method of attacking America. They would have to devote all their energies into surviving today and into tomorrow, and their barbaric tendencies would ensure that they focused all their rage on one another, fighting for the last living, non-irradiated virgin to rape. Islam would for all practical purposes be a thing of the past. We could simply turn our backs and watch them die.

"Again all worked out in minute detail. You will use only clean weapons. And sure the neighbouring countires will just suffer a little dust haze after Pakistan has been reduced to a dust bowl."

As I said, there is very little fallout from neutron bombs and it would not last long enough to threaten neighboring countries. We could also take them out with non-nuclear weapons.

"I know you have smart bombs with higher kill rates but just a little thought cropped up in my stupid mind. How many tons of ordinance was dropped on Vietnam. My stupid mind remembers something about it exceeding all the stuff dropped in WW1 and WW2 combined. And that gave food for thought to my stupid self. Vietnam was the lean and hungry tiger that mauled you. And now it is set to become one of the fat cats of Asia."

Again, an inaccurate comparison. One, we were not fighting to win in Viet Nam, and two, we were mainly bombing empty jungles, not dense population centers. One or two neutron bombs dropped in Iran, Saudi Arabia, or Malaysia would kill more Muslims than died in the entire history of the Vietnam war (1945-1975) with 2.3 to 3.8 millon dead in that war. Hell, one neutron bomb in Tehran alone would exceed that number by a factor of four.

"Can you please tweak your plan so that the 'nearly' occurring twice can be taken out. It make me nearly extremely nervous. "..pretty much inevitable." I will admit that is pretty prescient of you. I will tell you my preference after you get rid of the two 'nearlys'."Again, don't be foolish. You cannot reduce almost anything to an absolute zero chance. My plan does indeed make it nearly impossible though. On the other hand, Islam is trying to get its hands on nukes, it has already threatened to erase Israel and America off the face of the earth, and we know that when it comes to violence and genocide, Muslims do not jest. Allowing them to remain in America is inviting a planned disaster of which we are already aware, ie the American Hiroshima plot, and the Second Holocaust plan. That virtually assures nuclear war. Again, nothing is 100% certain, but let's use common sense!

I'll take a plan that generates a 99.9% chance of avoiding a nuclear war over a plan that generates even a 50% chance of nuclear war.

"America's civilized nature was not in doubt until I read all of the above. And I am sure those who leave peacefully will get a handsome price for their homes. Your BBB will ensure that."

If they don't, too bad. They at least get to keep their lives, which is more than they allow the victims of their genocides and planned genocides. Remember, they have had ample time and ample opportunity to reform their religion, if that was their intention.

"Okay. Pakistan and Iran are kaput. Why will Russia and China not makea little nuclear money on the side as they are doing now. You going to target them. This I gotta see."

Russian and China are not suicidal Muslim countries. Precisely why M.A.D. worked with Russia (Soviets). They are not going to commit suicide by stepping into a nuclear war in order to defend Muslims.

"Pakistan supposedly has a tight leash on their terrorists. And there are enough terrorists out there who will welcome thermonuclear annihilation as a short cut to martyrdom and the pleasures of direct entry to heaven instead of having to wait till Judgement day."

So why in God's name are we not giving them what they want? Kill 'em all, let Allah sort them out, that's my policy. If they're so eager to sacrifice themselves, why not be humane and assist them in their quest for martyrdom?

"Let us hope the Saudis are listening in but how are you going to prevent Bin laden type individuals (not much of a threat) among Muslims from doing unacceptable damage. Oh I know, you will squash the whole lot of them with thermonuclear annihilation."

Again, how do they get into America? Second, if there is even a smidgen of common sense or survival instinct left in the Muslim world, they will simply cut funding and not attack. And if they do, call out the exterminator, nuclear style. Bye-bye!

"I only want you to listen to my opinions not respect them."

Why even bother to listen to them? I can find a great many better things to fantasize about than insane plans to reform Islam from within via all the mythological moderates that you seem to believe exist yet in reality are about as evident as Bigfoot and the Loch Ness Monster.

"I gave you a plan that eliminated 1.2 billion people and your best(worst?) case scenario could eliminate only 400 million."

Your "plan" was a snotty remark and clearly not meant to be serious. Get real! Concocting a virus that only kills Muslims? What sort of nonsense is that?

"But then you know mine is unrealistic and half-baked etc. whereas a country that could come up with war strategists with not even a squirt (figure of speech) of commonsense are now going to come up with a detailed plan that will have a range of casualties anywhere from 20,000 to 500 million"

Again, it appears you have zero comprehension of my plan despite having it spelled out to you and despite having corrected you a million times. My plan, as you put it, does not have a range of 500 million dead. That is the number of dead likely through not implementing my plan and allowing the Muslims to continue to infiltrate and plot a nuclear blast in NYC.

"Comonsense, at least my kind of commonsense, tells me paper plans are as useless against the threat we are faced with as the paper it is written on"

It's not just a "paper plan". It is a well reasoned plan that has historical precedence on its side, and reality backing it as well. I suspect that's why it bothers you so.

"They have been fighting each other for 1400 years and still gave us plenty of thought. "

Only because we allowed them to migrate into our lands! Otherwise, they'd still be killing one another.

'We will have to sell them some neutrons and MOABs before we will hear their death rattle"

Wrong again. Well placed bombs would destroy most of their population, and the rest would die from the after-effects, ie lack of clean water and food, disease, lack of sanitation, lack of medical care, etc.

It is interesting though, how people like you who are so strongly opposed to my plan always seem to focus on the idea of a nuclear war. You seem to have a compulsion with looking at all-out nuclear war as the most likely and most preferred result, whereas my plan makes it the least likely and least desireable outcome.

"What! The Crusades exhausted them? I thought I was the only delusional one here. As long as they blindly believe their Book, they will never be exhausted."

When I say "exhausted", I mean beaten back, defeated. The Christians freed many Christian lands, but then played a game of give and take with the Muslims. And it does not matter if they believe in their book or not. As long as they are isolated, all they can do is kill one another, which is perfectly acceptable. If they turn twards the West, we annihilate them. They are totally free to engage in their orgy of genocide, rape, murder and mayhem as long as they confine their barbarity to Arabia against one another.

"They will be truly exhausted when they realise the nature of the book they swear by. If you can up with a plan to expose the Koran and other scriptures to the Muslims I will be first in line to approve that plan. Cheaper, and less blood and body parts on our TV screens."

"Expose" the Koran? It's already been exposed. People can read it in every language on the planet. It's only the Muslims and their apologists that live in denial of what it truly says. And again, it is not my burden to come up with a plan that fits your absurd claims. You're the one claiming that we can "convert" the so-called (and mythological) "moderate" Muslims, so it's your burden to come up with a detailed, realistic plan along those lines. I insist that any such plan is doomed to fail.

"Challenging the well-spring of their belief sounds simple kind and gentle? I have some experience of it. It is like twisting a serrated knife thrust in their rib-cage. Sometimes out comes the bullet and they are all the better for the pain. The Book of islam is under scrutiny everywhere. You may not admit it or know it but you are playing your part in it. You don't have to dive into a whirlpool (Saudi Arabia) to save a drowning man and die yourself, you throw him a lifejacket."

Again, you suffer under the delusion that you can compete with the entire culture of Islam...in their schools, their madrassahs, their mosques, and their homes. Where Islam dominates, you cannot convert them. Even in America you cannot convert them, because virtually to a person they believe their religion is infallible. Here's how I can concede your plan. We'd have to literally kidnap all the children from adult Muslims, house them in a de-programming detention center in order to purge their violent brainwashing, then into a re-indoctrination center to re-program them towards peaceful beliefs. Even restricting that action to Muslims in America alone, how do you propose to do that? What do we do with the resistant ones? Kill them? How do we deal with the parents? Kill them?

I know plenty of 3rd and 4th generation "American" Muslims, and to a person they are just as violent and nutty as the 1st generation. The only way to change them is to deprogram them. Where in the world are you going to get the ability, manpower, and facilities to do that?

"Keep your eyes on the underlined words when you read Mo's double speak (my paraphrasing): Muslims are allowed to change the political dynamics of other countries where sharia is not practised. I did not know we are expected to be mathematically precise in our observations. The thrust of the argument is irrelevant it seems. I will now take even longer to answer as I will agonise about whether I got the exact mathematically correct drift of your posts. As in differential calculus where in the limit delta x tends to zero the number of peaceful Muslims in the aggregate are just aberrations like the zero in calculus, zero but never really zero. Your mathematical definition of the quantum of peaceful muslims compared to the violent ones has exposed me as a liar, shame on me"

Again, you're being absurd. There are always exceptions to any rule. That's why the rule is the rule and the exception is the exception. For some reason, you and your crowd seem to believe that just because 0.00001% of Muslims are peaceful, that means there is hope for Islam to become peaceful. And yet the very opposite is happening...they are getting more and more violent with each increment of freedom and access to the West they receive. Hence the phenomenon of "moderate Muslims" is an aberration, an anomaly, a blip on the radar that holds no promise, no hope, no chance of success.

Aberration - n. - A deviation from the proper or expected course. A departure from the normal or typical.

Anomaly - n - Deviation or departure from the normal or common order, form, or rule.

"What is considered significant by one person could look insignificant to another like a glass being half empty or half full. And if you do not hold me to the gold standard of American values I could name some Muslim countries that are struggling to reach those standards."

Oh, don't give me that relativistic nonsense!

"Yes wish me good luck. For me even a fraction of 1% is okay."

Sorry, but a fraction of 1% is simply not workable in reality. You may, for example consider a replacement birth rate of 1.3 to be sufficient to allow a culture to continue growing, but reality tells us that is far too small a number. Likewise, a fraction of 1% of Muslims being peaceful is not going to be able to stand against or influence the other 99.999% who are violent.

"I know, you are not willing to spare the time."

It's not a matter of wanting, it's a matter of not having the time left! Muslims are migrating and reproducing at an alarming rate, and are as persistent as locusts in consuming their host countries. And we all see what happens once they reach a level of power. Genocide against non-Muslims. Happens every time. We cannot risk the future of the free world and billions of descendants' freedoms on the unprecedented, unrealistic, and delusional belief that a tiny aberration inside Islam will swell to encompass the whole. That's suicidal, insane behavior.

"Since you already know the answer to the thought experiment you threw at me my answer is superfluous. But allow me to expand on why I bring up the Native Indian issue. First of all they still exist in some corners of your country. Second I may be wrong, but I have never heard of a public apology by your government or senate for the valiant deeds of your recent forefathers. The Germans are reminded every now and then of the Holocaust, as rightly they should be. Why do you get hot under the collar about the Holocaust in the Americas. You are a military tactician and strategist and I need not tell you, you attack the weak point of your opponent. And like Ali working on his opponent's cut eye brow I am working to open the chink a bit more to see what is under the skin."

No, what you are doing is skirting the issue and engaging in obfuscation. We've covered this a dozen times, I have answered in detail on it each time, and it is irrelevant in any way to what we are talking about. What you're actually trying to do is engage in a transparent attempt at moral relativism, and I will not be led down that road of lies. I don't get hot under the collar about killing the Native Americans. I denounce it in the strongest possible terms...it was unacceptable, reprehensible, illegal, horrendous, inhuman genocide. Period. I have never said otherwise. But it is also irrelevant to our discussion. If you want to start a thread on another subject about the genocide of the Native Americans, feel free. My objection is that you are trying to link it to the Muslim issue, and the two are totally unrelated. It is nothing more than an attempt to derail the argument. There's my only objection. You're getting like Michel, thinking he's found a sensitive or soft spot. Wrong. You give yourself (undeserved) airs.

"Now that you have released some more details of that detailed plan of yours (with the reality of history built into it) the greatest number at risk is 500 million deaths which is insignificant, like those mythical peaceful Muslims, or happily if all the well laid plans of mice and men go as planned only 20,000 deaths."

And yet all you can do to attack my plan is offer strawman arguments and misrepresentation of my details.

"I am with you there all the way but not by genocide and misery even of a death cult, for sure then you will become their mirror image"

Again, don't give me that nonsense. Did we become the Nazis in WWII? Did we become the Soviets in the Cold War? No. Your argument is invalid. And for the 50th time, I am not advocating genocide. You seem to attend the Goebbels School of Debate, believing that if you utter a great lie often enough, it will be believed. Unfortunately for you, I am able to counter your propaganda each time, and correct you publicly, where your lie is clearly exposed. I am calling for the deportation and banning of an evil sociopolitical ideology called Islam, an evil ideology dedicated to our destruction, and the isolation of that evil to its breeding grounds. Nuclear annihilation is a deterrent, the same deterrent we used against the Soviets.

You, Plato, cannot debate this with me honestly, because you know you will lose. You insist on using lies and propaganda to misquote, misinterpret, and misrepresent my claims, because you need that propaganda in order to vilify me in your eyes and allow you to dismiss my plan without the burden of looking at it honestly.

"Your wish is coming true in Iraq with some help from your government. You should be happy."

I guess we are doing something right after all!

"Your action there has probably created more terrorists than ever existed"

Nonsense. They're simply being enticed out of their hiding holes like cockroaches. Most of them are coming from terrorist states like Iran and Syria.

"The Native Americans are really getting under your skin."

The Native Americans are not getting under my skin. What's irritating me is listening to you whine about them incessantly when they are utterly irrelevant to the discussion. You're thumping your chest because you believe you've "touched a nerve" when all you've done is tire me of listening to you evade and obfuscate the issue with your Native American nonsense.

"If you end up annihilating 500 million muslims (the worst case scenario in your detailed plan) a descendant of yours may have to squirm with discomfort when he has to field a similar question. Shoot me down again. But the Native Indian issue will rise again like the Phoenix."

Wrong again. No one, least of all me, is "squirming with discomfort" over the situation with Native Americans. I have no guilt over that, as I have no guilty over slaver in the early days. I had nothing to do with it, I condemn it, and it's a dark chapter in American history. One which I condemn. However, it is irrelvant to the discussion and nothing more than an attempt at obfucation and evasion. And it does not matter if you kepe bringing it up, because I am tired of repeating myself on the issue. You've had it explained to you enough times to understand my point, if you have even a smidgen of intelligence. From now on, when you bring it up, it will merely be dismissed as what it is...an impotent attempt to distract from the matter at hand and an attempt at obfuscation.

"You have minimised it to the extent of 100 million out of about 600 million. Reality begins where delusion ends"We killed 100 million Iraqis? Then there are no Iraqies alive, since there are only 26.7 million Iraqis. I guess you're getting your numbers from the same insane source where Michel gets his 30 million Muslims in America. Hmmm...maybe you're one of Michel's split personalities, just Michel posting under another user ID and talking to yourself? Interesting.

"The above is what I got from Wikipedia. You seem to have tweaked the concept to punish people in the present life itself than in the reincarnated one as in the original."Unfortunately for you, I am somewhat of a Vedic scholar. The definition of karma you see there is a perversion of the original Vedic concept of karma, which was merely the law of cause and effect. You touch a hot stove, you burn your hand. That's the original concept of karma, summarized and simplified. It's not "I did bad things in this life so bad things will happen to me in the next". That (mis)understanding is a simplistic and inaccurate definition.

"If what is happening in the world is according to karmic principles why are you so worked up about Muslims running rampage. They are just working out their karma."

Wrong. Your understanding of karma is inaccurate and simplistic. Karma is Islam attacking the west and being annihilated in response. Cause and effect.

"Very ancient Pythagorean and Indian pschobabble"There we can agree! However, it is your understanding of karma that is psychobabble. The original concept is valid.

"The hardest question here is one of ethics. The ethics of having decimated a whole race. Remember the Holocaust is also in the past, why is everyone obsessing about it today in the twentyfirst century. Why is the Indian case any different and does it not count as a holocaust? And the ethics of deporting millions of Muslims,the good and the ugly along with the bad Don't tell me. You don't care, their ethics are deplorable.."

People are not "obsessing about" the Holocaust in the 21st century. We are remembering it because it is being attempted once again. The entire Muslim world wants to enact a 2nd Holocaust on the Jews, even while denying the first one (in which they played a role!). They have publicly admitted to their insane, genocidal goals.

No one, on the other hand, is advocating a genocide against the surviving Native Americans. Nobody said the Native American holocaust was not a holocaust, least of all me. It is simply irrelevant to the discussion and being used only as a tool to derail and obfuscate the discussion, and as an instrument to argue for moral relativism, which it does not accomplish. It's nothing more than smoke being blown by two people (who may be the same person posting as different people...notice how Michel has gotten very quiet while you've suddenly become very active and with the same grammar and spelling).

And the ethics of deporting Muslims is not deplorable. I maintain that they endorse and encourage terror or at the very least refuse to purge their religion of it. Hence guilty as willing accomplices. Now go change into your Michel clothing and tell us about your walks along the beach with your pack of dogs.

Note: Opinions expressed in comments are those of the authors alone and not necessarily those of Daniel Pipes. Original writing only, please. Comments are screened and in some cases edited before posting. Reasoned disagreement is welcome but not comments that are scurrilous, off-topic, commercial, disparaging religions, or otherwise inappropriate. For complete regulations, see the "Guidelines for Reader Comments".


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Title Commenter Date Thread
2George Orwell : "If there was hope, it must lie in the proles." [82 words]mythJan 17, 2010 20:20167454
Beautifully said [133 words]PrashantAug 18, 2016 22:43167454
3How the West Could Lose [168 words]AnneSep 20, 2008 10:59138894
Interesting point of view... [85 words]TousifOct 21, 2009 02:53138894
1how the west could lose [78 words]jamesJun 21, 2010 23:48138894
4How the West could lose. I think you will be surprised at the final outcome. response to James. [101 words]Anne-USAJun 23, 2010 16:43138894
how the west could lost - response to Anne [67 words]jamesJun 24, 2010 01:12138894
1How the West Lost- There will be evil in the last days, we expect rough times. response to James [354 words]Anne- USAJun 24, 2010 19:26138894
1the left wing must be stopped and exposed [36 words]stefanoMar 4, 2008 00:21121684
The Leftwing must be stopped and exposed-----by Stephano [345 words]DebbieJul 20, 2008 10:16121684
Really America, really? [49 words]JasnaDec 26, 2008 20:14121684
1how many more must die... before we all see ? [180 words]Phil GreendOct 6, 2007 18:51110560
We need to put aside political correctness and discuss Islam [365 words]Dennis GravesSep 11, 2007 15:22108556
counter thought... [123 words]donvanOct 18, 2007 09:24108556
2ISLAM NOT A RELIGION OF PEACE. [3 words]Nina NiaziOct 19, 2007 19:24108556
1We, the People. [122 words]Linda HaslamOct 20, 2007 00:16108556
1right on brother! [375 words]kid berthaNov 5, 2007 15:19108556
islam not a religon of peace [158 words]Nina niaziNov 20, 2007 10:06108556
1Brits deserve it!!! [186 words]JaladhiNov 20, 2007 20:22108556
3Islam: Religion of Peace? [85 words]Linda HaslamNov 27, 2007 09:42108556
2ISLAM NOT A RELIGION OF PEACE [207 words]nina niaziDec 2, 2007 17:40108556
God's children??? [139 words]Linda HaslamDec 6, 2007 11:11108556
2Jaladhi get an education old chap! [177 words]Leven-TorresApr 14, 2008 09:04108556
1try to learn scripture first [36 words]johnMay 18, 2008 05:02108556
1Don't misquote the Qur'an please. [832 words]KeithJul 22, 2008 18:22108556
islam excuses [2162 words]paul dunnNov 28, 2008 17:42108556
don't make any illusions [122 words]SunaJan 18, 2010 15:26108556
Ignorance: a dangerous thing [78 words]HamiyetMay 6, 2012 16:07108556
The War that we are Fighting [1925 words]Major DaveMay 23, 2007 17:3894113
My average American's opinion [768 words]kid berthaJun 12, 2007 16:1994113
So what is your solution? [1942 words]Major DaveJun 12, 2007 23:5394113
misunderstood [1256 words]kid berthaJun 14, 2007 11:1894113
My Respect [341 words]MichelAug 25, 2007 15:0694113
Oh, boy......... [76 words]Nick4693Sep 13, 2007 19:5294113
1ISLAM NOT A RELIGION OF PEACE. [156 words]Nina NiaziOct 19, 2007 16:3694113
1Nina is correct. [432 words]kid berthaNov 5, 2007 14:4394113
ISLAM NOT A RELIGION OF PEACE [114 words]NinaNov 7, 2007 18:1994113
bravo [110 words]kcOct 21, 2009 01:0394113
Islam is not a relgion of Peace [20 words]sahilApr 10, 2011 13:5694113
2Monotheism vs Polytheism [225 words]IndianMay 17, 2007 03:5993309
Very right but still slightly off. [140 words]True-IndianSep 22, 2007 11:2693309
what is the truth? [51 words]najeebSep 15, 2009 09:1293309
Shiites [59 words]Dr Erich MeyerMay 8, 2007 23:5892175
1Why US should attack Islamic Iran now ??? [642 words]ShivaMay 4, 2007 10:1591639
1Finally a factual message has been posted [372 words]kid berthaMay 5, 2007 09:3291639
1Right on! [332 words]Nick4693Sep 13, 2007 22:5291639
there's no why! [84 words]SunaJan 18, 2010 15:3691639
Plato [302 words]SohailApr 22, 2007 06:2090156
To Sohail: All mixed up [210 words]PlatoApr 23, 2007 08:4390156
So why should the West be the winner???? [2 words]aliApr 16, 2007 10:0089384
Answers for Ali [93 words]Noah WilkApr 19, 2007 18:3889384
how i see it [74 words]warnerApr 20, 2007 01:0189384
Ali your answer is in the Taliban video [99 words]PlatoApr 22, 2007 01:5889384
Three words for you [3 words]RJMay 1, 2007 00:0889384
How the West could lose: Reply to Mr.Ali. [47 words]Jaisingh ThakurJul 13, 2007 00:1689384
Why [35 words]aliJul 21, 2007 14:3489384
No... [93 words]adfJul 20, 2008 15:1789384
3why most of iranian hate arabs and islam? [17 words]persianDec 16, 2008 17:3189384
iranians hate arabs [4 words]joeSep 11, 2009 17:5189384
To Be the Big Dog or Not [628 words]MichaelApr 11, 2007 11:4989023
A muslim duty [581 words]moderate MuslimApr 7, 2007 00:0088762
Reality check and fantasy [50 words]dhimmi no moreApr 7, 2007 18:1488762
make no sense [14 words]moderate MuslimApr 8, 2007 22:2288762
Yes I read it in Arabic a language that you do not know [27 words]dhimmi no moreApr 9, 2007 18:0988762
Honest answers, please! [343 words]Nick4693Sep 11, 2007 19:5788762
Now one question [106 words]moderate MuslimApr 6, 2007 23:3388757
M&M and his bogus context again and Q9:4 or 5 if you wish [53 words]dhimmi no moreApr 7, 2007 18:5188757
i dont even know [228 words]a muslim americanMar 27, 2007 22:1888086
Our dear M&M and Islamic meltdown part deux [19 words]dhimmi no moreMar 28, 2007 17:1588086
1A NORMAL MUSLIM... [341 words]DONVANApr 5, 2007 14:0488086
oil and water [86 words]todd morrisonOct 16, 2007 23:2588086
wow.... [51 words]moderate MuslimMar 27, 2007 15:3388065
It says ya ayuha al-nass! [105 words]dhimmi no moreMar 29, 2007 17:5788065
dhimmi, READ YOUR OWN EVIDENCE FIRST [225 words]moderate MuslimMar 30, 2007 19:3088065
For Our dear M&M and his bogus arabic and the Qur'an really says that islam is the religion of the Arabs only and you ain't one [718 words]dhimmi no moreApr 2, 2007 19:4188065
The poor Arabic translation of Picktall another wannabe Arab! [446 words]dhimmi no moreApr 3, 2007 07:2688065
For our dear M&m and argument from silence! And Islam is indeed the religion of the Hijazi Arabs as per Q14:4 and you ain't one [30 words]dhimmi no moreApr 5, 2007 18:1488065
One more time pt 2 [243 words]moderate MuslimMar 26, 2007 19:2788016
fantasy world of islam [286 words]susanMar 28, 2007 15:2688016
Still in denial, "Moderate" Muslim [357 words]Noah WilkMar 28, 2007 16:5988016
yeah ok [26 words]moderate MuslimMar 28, 2007 19:1988016
3Why are you making excuses, Moderate Muslim? [322 words]Noah WilkMar 31, 2007 17:5688016
were you at the rallies? [40 words]susanApr 1, 2007 10:0388016
Ok, so What? [11 words]moderate MuslimApr 2, 2007 19:0388016
the usual cheap excuse [11 words]susanApr 3, 2007 02:5688016
Ignorance is no excuse [168 words]Noah WilkApr 5, 2007 14:5188016
I will not stand for hate. [42 words]moderate MuslimApr 6, 2007 23:3688016
Moderate Muslim corners himself! [393 words]Noah WilkApr 7, 2007 16:2488016
Misunderstanding [311 words]moderate MuslimApr 7, 2007 21:1588016
easy [51 words]susanApr 8, 2007 07:1888016
the 1960's [27 words]moderate MuslimApr 8, 2007 22:2488016
not an "image" problem [297 words]susanApr 9, 2007 07:2088016
Speaking of hate and the Qur'an [83 words]dhimmi no moreApr 9, 2007 18:1988016
Why not burn effigies? [80 words]Noah WilkApr 9, 2007 20:5288016
noah [62 words]moderate MuslimApr 10, 2007 21:4888016
Back to Morous (12 seconds on the shot clock) [3677 words]moderate MuslimMar 25, 2007 22:1287974
Our dear M&M and cut and paste jobs Paki/Arabic and the bogus hadith! [522 words]dhimmi no moreMar 27, 2007 20:2387974
an addendum and my source for the hadith literary criticism [20 words]dhimmi no moreMar 28, 2007 07:0687974
My compliments to the sheik (morous 360 dunk in moderate's face, the crowd goes wild) [1370 words]MOROUSMar 28, 2007 16:3987974
To Moderate Muslim: [894 words]PlatoMar 30, 2007 04:2287974
No, I respect many [89 words]moderate MuslimMar 30, 2007 19:2587974
To Moderate Muslim: But Allah hates other religions [234 words]PlatoApr 1, 2007 02:0587974
numbers matter [54 words]susanApr 1, 2007 10:1387974
Here's your answer Plato [129 words]moderate MuslimApr 2, 2007 19:0987974
heh, ok right, that is so bogus [40 words]moderate MuslimApr 2, 2007 19:2487974
let's start from... [46 words]susanApr 3, 2007 03:1587974
And speaking of bogus! [86 words]dhimmi no moreApr 4, 2007 17:2987974
your answer [535 words](moderate) Muslim (though all real Muslims are moderate)Apr 5, 2007 22:0887974
christian arabs are first victims of muslims [243 words]susanApr 8, 2007 07:2687974
Islam and Terror [1398 words]moderate Muslim AmericanMar 22, 2007 17:4387720
Hamza Yusuf a Muslim scholar? LOL! [187 words]dhimmi no moreMar 23, 2007 19:2287720
5Nothing's more fun than debunking "Muslim Logic" [2959 words]Noah WilkMar 23, 2007 21:1887720
To Moderate Muslim: It is just a wish-list you have given us [2577 words]PlatoMar 24, 2007 06:4087720
M&M and David Chappelle exposed [147 words]dhimmi no moreMar 25, 2007 09:1487720
high muslim clerics agree with bin laden [394 words]susanMar 27, 2007 15:2487720
ok? [44 words]moderate Muslim-Mar 27, 2007 22:0087720
you just proved how ignorant islamphobes are [82 words]Islamophobic ignoranceMar 28, 2007 15:2687720
Precisely why we condemn you [380 words]Noah WilkMar 28, 2007 17:1887720
The little olive institute [32 words]dhimmi no moreMar 28, 2007 17:4587720
Our dear M&M and Yusuf Hamza's ancestry [25 words]dhimmi no moreMar 28, 2007 17:5187720
thanks.. [8 words]moderate MuslimMar 28, 2007 19:2087720
Islamophobia, really? [298 words]dhimmi no moreMar 29, 2007 07:2287720
Because , the most comfortable position for a coward is to struggle to be portrayed a "moderate" (&) Moslem. [611 words]Ynna(tchkah)Mar 29, 2007 13:4087720
poor reply [71 words]susanMar 29, 2007 13:4287720
like you said something... [91 words]susanMar 29, 2007 13:5087720
we need ears to listen and eyes to see [252 words]Islamophobia no more...Mar 29, 2007 16:3887720
chechnya is sufi [20 words]susanApr 1, 2007 10:1487720
I dont think you get it (Ynna (tchkah) [129 words]moderate MuslimApr 2, 2007 19:2387720
and why? [41 words]moderate MuslimApr 2, 2007 19:2787720
Our dear Islamophobia no more and his little diatribes [48 words]dhimmi no moreApr 2, 2007 19:5487720
Congratulations for not going to work to CAIR [108 words]Ynna (tchkah)Apr 3, 2007 03:0287720
skewed perception of Islamophobes [138 words]Islamophobia no moreApr 3, 2007 03:0387720
africa's fault is african [146 words]susanApr 3, 2007 03:2287720
an Islamophobe [259 words]Islamophobia no moreApr 3, 2007 03:3287720
cair wants sharia [39 words]susanApr 3, 2007 03:3987720
More diatribes from our dear INM aka M&M [103 words]dhimmi no moreApr 3, 2007 18:4387720
YOU DON'T GET THE POINT [19 words]moderate MuslimApr 3, 2007 20:2787720
For our dear INM and what is an Islamophobe part deux [343 words]dhimmi no moreApr 4, 2007 07:5387720
no matter how you turn it [67 words]susanApr 4, 2007 14:5187720
nobody is irrationally vilifying islam [234 words]susanApr 4, 2007 15:0887720
sharia allows slavery [18 words]susanApr 4, 2007 17:3987720
Dropping names and Si, comprende mucho! [111 words]dhimmi no moreApr 4, 2007 17:4887720
fallacy of bias history-reading [108 words]Islamophobia no moreApr 5, 2007 01:5987720
islamophobia, the stupidest word ever invented [124 words]susanApr 5, 2007 16:3087720
Cair and other people [171 words]moderate MuslimApr 5, 2007 22:1587720
CAIR [374 words]Noah WilkApr 6, 2007 14:5587720
Why then do you support it? [290 words]Noah WilkApr 6, 2007 15:0387720
cair = sharia = stone age [70 words]susanApr 6, 2007 15:1987720
Noah [124 words]moderate MuslimApr 6, 2007 23:4087720
M&M CAIR (big time LOL) and his flawed logic! [344 words]dhimmi no moreApr 7, 2007 08:3787720
Yes, Moderate Muslim, you ARE responsible! [516 words]Noah WilkApr 7, 2007 16:4587720
ROTFL [44 words]dhimmi no moreApr 7, 2007 18:3787720
al-Shari3a [10 words]dhimmi no moreApr 7, 2007 18:3987720
CAIR and mockery [26 words]dhimmi no moreApr 8, 2007 11:4087720
i'll see [37 words]moderate MuslimApr 8, 2007 22:3487720
Why aren't moderate muslims standing up? [55 words]Bob SterlingAug 20, 2007 23:5187720
why should the west win anyways if it continues with its current programme of warmongering? [434 words]cocoMay 6, 2009 12:0187720
islam & terror [627 words]John EdwardsOct 27, 2009 15:1387720
so here are you answers more if you want em [29 words]moderate MuslimMar 20, 2007 19:3287302
Moderate Muslim fails again! [1415 words]Noah WilkMar 21, 2007 15:3287302
mauritania has got legal slavery, allowed in islam [15 words]susanMar 21, 2007 16:5787302
MM [230 words]JaladhiMar 21, 2007 18:0187302
handshake with Kuffar? "Muslim debate schemes" and other sordid matters! [599 words]dhimmi no moreMar 22, 2007 07:5187302
morocco 50% literacy rate [18 words]susanMar 22, 2007 10:0387302
"Muslim debate schemes"! part deux [452 words]dhimmi no moreMar 24, 2007 14:1087302
Dhimmi No More - defenders of the faith have left town!!! [40 words]JaladhiMar 26, 2007 16:5687302
Your answer Plato (which is a really bad name for you, because it dishonores someone who actually thought [169 words]Moderate MuslimMar 20, 2007 19:1887298
Was the post for me? [45 words]PlatoMar 21, 2007 08:3087298
Try paying attention, Moderate Muslim [570 words]Noah WilkMar 21, 2007 17:5587298
blatantly clear? LOL [178 words]dhimmi no moreMar 21, 2007 19:5087298
To MM: Would Mohammed be a good name for me? [130 words]PlatoMar 22, 2007 14:0087298
you guys hate the truth, dontcha [23 words]moderate MuslimMar 22, 2007 17:1087298
clarification [36 words]Moderate MuslimMar 22, 2007 17:1287298
No, Im not beyond help, although I dont need much [73 words]moderate MuslimMar 22, 2007 17:1587298
Free will in islam? LOL [379 words]dhimmi no moreMar 24, 2007 08:1587298
you like lies don'tcha? [148 words]susanMar 25, 2007 10:2187298
To Syed [17 words]moderate MuslimMar 16, 2007 19:3086570
LOL syed is asking for caliphate [8 words]susanMar 18, 2007 10:1686570
Syed? LOL He has no credibility! [172 words]dhimmi no moreMar 18, 2007 12:5086570
Syeds are not Iranians?? [83 words]JaladhiMar 19, 2007 17:1886570
What? [35 words]moderate MuslimMar 19, 2007 19:2486570
For our dear M&M and islam [73 words]dhimmi no moreMar 20, 2007 17:4886570
To Moderate Muslim: Spreading Islam by avoiding unpleasant facts [389 words]PlatoMar 22, 2007 13:3586570
Sure, Syed's the perfect choice [230 words]JeffMar 27, 2007 18:2386570
i wasnt..... [77 words]moderate MuslimMar 27, 2007 22:0286570
THE JOKE'S ON YOU (DHIMMI) [32 words]moderate MuslimMar 16, 2007 19:2786568
And your point is? [244 words]dhimmi no moreMar 18, 2007 12:4086568
You dont know me, you dont even care [110 words]moderate MuslimMar 19, 2007 19:3686568
avoiding the sex slaves matter [52 words]susanMar 20, 2007 16:1186568
Uno Questiono por legion of doom [36 words]moderate MuslimMar 16, 2007 19:2586566
To Moderate Muslim: Global warming a belief? [63 words]PlatoMar 17, 2007 23:1186566
The Official Stance of the Legion of Doom On Global Warming [59 words]Noah WilkMar 18, 2007 10:1786566
youre just not answering [43 words]moderate MuslimMar 19, 2007 19:2986566
heheh, thanks plato [25 words]moderate MuslimMar 19, 2007 19:3086566
You were indeed given an answer [209 words]Noah WilkMar 20, 2007 15:2986566
They're not scared [107 words]Noah WilkMar 20, 2007 15:3686566
sex slaves conspiracy [101 words]susanMar 20, 2007 16:1486566
?? [72 words]moderate MuslimMar 22, 2007 17:1986566
Yes, you are on trial [223 words]Noah WilkMar 23, 2007 18:5786566
islam is not on trial, it's already convicted [14 words]susanMar 25, 2007 10:2686566
heh please [45 words]moderate MuslimMar 26, 2007 19:1686566
Spain and Arabian imperialism and justifying the absurd [69 words]dhimmi no moreMar 27, 2007 20:4886566
spain? islam flourished? [2978 words]susanMar 28, 2007 02:5786566
Islam is peace [103 words]moderate MuslimMar 14, 2007 21:3686334
disproved [331 words]susanMar 15, 2007 16:2486334
Islam and violence and silence [116 words]dhimmi no moreMar 18, 2007 17:3486334
uh NO [7 words]moderate MuslimMar 19, 2007 19:2586334
Our dear M&M has never been to a madrassa! [81 words]dhimmi no moreMar 24, 2007 14:2286334
A Peaceful Muslim Country (oh my) [259 words]moderate MuslimMar 11, 2007 21:2185929
...muslim [492 words]susanMar 12, 2007 18:3085929
very poor example [255 words]susanMar 12, 2007 18:4085929
Dave Chapelle? and who the heck is he? And why should we like him or hate him for this matter [235 words]dhimmi no moreMar 12, 2007 19:3985929
MALAYSIA A PEACEFUL MUSLIM COUNTRY???LOL [110 words]MOROUSMar 13, 2007 16:5385929
Malaysia is Saudi Arabia of East [142 words]JaladhiMar 13, 2007 19:1385929
Talking points, pillars, quibbles, quotes, examples, and some words of wisdom from the kennedys. [972 words]moderate MuslimMar 13, 2007 19:3285929
MY EMAILS? [13 words]muslimMar 13, 2007 21:2385929
Malaysia is Saudi Arabia of East - Pt. 2 [133 words]JaladhiMar 14, 2007 16:2785929
The good ole pillars of islam! [84 words]dhimmi no moreMar 14, 2007 16:4385929
kennedy quote? [659 words]susanMar 14, 2007 16:4485929
why does everyone not get it [32 words]moderate MuslimMar 14, 2007 19:4085929
huh?? [339 words]morousMar 15, 2007 12:2285929
Our dear M&M and you ain't Muqatil [61 words]dhimmi no moreMar 15, 2007 20:0485929
To Morous-Clarify a few things [291 words]moderate MuslimMar 15, 2007 21:2585929
your clarification Moderate [664 words]MorousMar 17, 2007 11:4685929
one clarification: malaysia has got sharia law [41 words]susanMar 18, 2007 10:1985929
literal interpretation [68 words]susanMar 18, 2007 10:2285929
Reply to Reply : morous [116 words]moderate MuslimMar 18, 2007 17:1585929
women as humans? [31 words]susanMar 20, 2007 04:5185929
It's Back in your court MODERATE [616 words]MorousMar 20, 2007 13:2585929
Malaysia? [171 words]surjApr 20, 2007 22:3485929
More Answers (Aisha) (ra) [2787 words]moderate MuslimMar 11, 2007 21:0685919
aisha the child [103 words]susanMar 12, 2007 18:3385919
To Moderate Muslim: Hiding the shame of Aisha's age and a Maulana abrogates 9:29 [989 words]PlatoMar 13, 2007 01:1385919
3A'isha and real history! and playing with dolls! [648 words]dhimmi no moreMar 13, 2007 07:2885919
Lies will not change historical age of Aisha at the time of her marriage [157 words]JaladhiMar 20, 2007 15:4385919
The Ultimate Post- No Hiding, No Crying, Just Answers [8353 words]moderate MuslimMar 8, 2007 22:1385330
I'm cherry picking Moderate Muslim's huge post [2178 words]Noah WilkMar 9, 2007 04:1485330
For our dear M&M and his bogus command of Islamic theology [454 words]dhimmi no moreMar 9, 2007 18:0085330
To Moderate Muslim: Ethical basis of Islam and the thrashing of women by men [2001 words]PlatoMar 10, 2007 07:3085330
For our dear Moderate Msulim and what is really a moderate Muslim?And other sordid matters [885 words]dhimmi no moreMar 10, 2007 07:4085330
More Answers-To Dhimmi [293 words]moderate MuslimMar 10, 2007 13:2085330
Our dear M&M and he is really a "bait"? and Jihad or holy war revisited part deux [653 words]dhimmi no moreMar 10, 2007 14:1585330
moderate [592 words]susanMar 10, 2007 15:0185330
For our dear M&M and Q2:216 ...part one! [832 words]dhimmi no moreMar 11, 2007 09:2885330
dhimmi ... [26 words]susanMar 11, 2007 10:3985330
For our dear M&M and Q9:4 part deux! [541 words]dhimmi no moreMar 11, 2007 14:4185330
moderate Muslim [61 words]moderate MuslimMar 11, 2007 17:4285330
Condemnable Offenses. Controlling Men [91 words]moderate MuslimMar 11, 2007 17:4585330
you have no idea what a race is again [13 words]susanMar 12, 2007 03:3885330
M&M and more fantasy [262 words]dhimmi no moreMar 12, 2007 07:5285330
To Moderate Muslim: Fight to make your neighbours submit to Allah [179 words]PlatoMar 12, 2007 10:1585330
response to moderate muslim [555 words]morousMar 12, 2007 16:2585330
invented by modern people? [111 words]susanMar 12, 2007 18:3085330
yeah, so? [97 words]moderate MuslimMar 12, 2007 19:2485330
To Moderate Muslim: On rape and chopping off hands [583 words]PlatoMar 12, 2007 23:1885330
Uh no [17 words]moderate MuslimMar 13, 2007 19:3385330
the joke is on you morous [36 words]moderate MuslimMar 13, 2007 19:3685330
Hypocritical Muslim [56 words]Noah WilkMar 13, 2007 20:4385330
origins [183 words]dhimmi no moreMar 13, 2007 21:5885330
Racism! Really? [147 words]dhimmi no moreMar 14, 2007 12:3185330
i am 100% correct [57 words]susanMar 14, 2007 16:2285330
More evidence [47 words]dhimmi no moreMar 14, 2007 16:5685330
Hypocrisy - thy name is.... [46 words]JaladhiMar 14, 2007 17:3185330
1Jesus is god? [26 words]moderate muslimMar 14, 2007 19:3185330
not quite making sense - at all [129 words]moderate MuslimMar 14, 2007 19:3785330
lies [30 words]moderate MuslimMar 14, 2007 19:3885330
His words? [226 words]dhimmi no moreMar 15, 2007 07:3985330
Muslims suppress free debate on anti Semitism at Leeds University, UK [163 words]DelboyMar 15, 2007 09:4985330
MM [135 words]susanMar 15, 2007 16:1485330
2My dear M&M and i'm glad that you asked and the Qur'an really says that Jesus is God! [93 words]dhimmi no moreMar 15, 2007 19:5985330
Uh what? [38 words]moderate MuslimMar 16, 2007 19:2185330
MM - Read Dhimmi No More's(who knows Arabic) posts to understand Q9:4 [92 words]JaladhiMar 19, 2007 17:4885330
Respond to what? [58 words]dhimmi no moreMar 19, 2007 20:1485330
For our dear M&M and the Qur'an really says that jesus is God and the bogus tawheed [140 words]dhimmi no moreMar 20, 2007 07:5185330
THAT'S NOT WHAT THE KORAN SAYS [22 words]MOROUSMar 20, 2007 14:0285330
The fundamentally faulty logic of the person called dhimmi no more [201 words]moderate MuslimMar 20, 2007 19:0185330
Astaghfirullah is M&M's lame answer [239 words]dhimmi no moreMar 23, 2007 07:2885330
Flat? Hardly [31 words]Moderate MuslimMar 25, 2007 21:5385330
Hand Chopping and Adultery [74 words]Mukhtar Ahmed KashifJul 30, 2009 12:4785330
Why I am proud to be a member of the Legion of Doom! [354 words]Noah WilkMar 8, 2007 21:0985321
The wake up call [15 words]Moderate MuslimFeb 26, 2007 16:2579077
You're talking, but you're not saying anything, Moderate Muslim [499 words]Noah WilkFeb 26, 2007 20:3579077
PEACEFUL NATION? YEAH, COMPARED TO THE HUNS [53 words]Moderate MuslimFeb 28, 2007 07:3279077
homework for moderate muslim [155 words]susanFeb 28, 2007 15:3479077
MM, you very well described actions of Muslims [98 words]JaladhiFeb 28, 2007 17:4279077
mob muslim contradiction [97 words]susanFeb 28, 2007 18:1079077
to mod.muslim [145 words]AnnaFeb 28, 2007 19:3479077
Susan [507 words]Moderate MuslimFeb 28, 2007 20:3479077
For our dear M&M and more fantasy [371 words]dhimmi no moreMar 1, 2007 06:0279077
peace.. [125 words]donvanMar 1, 2007 09:1879077
YES [87 words]Moderate MuslimMar 1, 2007 19:5079077
Strive to forgive what? [15 words]dhimmi no moreMar 2, 2007 17:2279077
don't believe you [65 words]susanMar 3, 2007 12:4879077
Response to Susan [153 words]moderate MuslimMar 5, 2007 20:0779077
educated fanatics.. [14 words]donvanMar 6, 2007 15:0079077
Anti-Semitic propaganda from our "Moderate" Muslim [340 words]Noah WilkMar 7, 2007 12:5179077
so many mistakes again [263 words]susanMar 7, 2007 15:0279077

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